------=_NextPart_000_0073_01BF7D2C.EB440600 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="a couple of items you may wish to know.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="a couple of items you may wish to know.eml" Return-Path: Received: from s20.highertech.net (root@s20.highertech.net [209.54.120.20]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA22051 [xxxxxx] Sat, 13 Feb 1999 14:00:26 -0600 (CST) Received: from pizzard.chattanooga.net (tnt1-107.highertech.net [[xxxxxx]]) by s20.highertech.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id OAA21705; Sat, 13 Feb 1999 14:58:50 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990213143451.00988600@mail.mccallie.org> X-Sender: tstowell@mail.mccallie.org X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sat, 13 Feb 1999 14:34:51 -0500 To: "Beth Wills" , "Betsy" , "Bill Oliver" , "Bridgett" , "Celia Snyder" , "Ginger Cisewski" , "Jan Craven" , "Jim Powell" , "Kay Mason" , "Kim Harris Myers" , "Lynn Watermann" , "Megan Zurawicz" , "Trey Holt" , "Yvonne James-Henderson" From: Tim Stowell Subject: a couple of items you may wish to know In-Reply-To: <01be573a$98800900$46bb8ecf@default> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: 65067c344d341200210881fbd525aa41 My address - Tim Stowell 4869 Hillsdale Circle Chattanooga, TN 37416-1225 423.344.0886 regular email addy - tstowell@chattanooga.net - home emergency addy - tstowell@mccallie.org - work ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Effective 2/11, I resigned my position with the bylaws committee - "Your offer of having me just monitor the list but be a non-voting ex-officio member may lead your committee to think that my being there in that capacity lends credibility or official status (whatever that means?) to your committee, which in my opinion it does not. Since I've now been elected National Coordinator of the USGenWeb Project and State Coordinator for Georgia my duties there are going to keep me too busy to continue to read this list. Therefore, please remove me from the list and committee at your earliest convenience." ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Tim ------=_NextPart_000_0073_01BF7D2C.EB440600 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="A Leak on the board.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="A Leak on the board.eml" Return-Path: Received: from imo14.mx.aol.com (imo14.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.4]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA02955 [xxxxxx] Sat, 20 Feb 1999 18:08:10 -0600 (CST) From: FEATHER2s@aol.com Received: from FEATHER2s@aol.com by imo14.mx.aol.com (IMOv18.1) id VQSZa05514 [xxxxxx] Sat, 20 Feb 1999 19:07:17 +1900 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 19:07:17 EST To: cestus3@inetnebr.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: A Leak on the board?? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 205 X-UIDL: fe9506c302d5373a1018927d28765e7a This is an excerpt from today's Daily board Show: Will It Ever End Corner: Since someone at Census II has filed a formal complaint against Linda Lewis, who "did willfully and knowingly cause to have sent to the mailing list of The USGenWeb Census Project, a letter wherewith she attempted to cause confusion and discord amongst the members and volunteers of that mailing list by inference and lies" [or so says the complaint sent to the Board, and it IS a doozy], Obviously someone leaked this, and I want to know WHO... Leaking a Grievance is especially NOT GOOD and Bill and I are going to have a "fit" so be prepared ginger ------=_NextPart_000_0073_01BF7D2C.EB440600 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="'bylaws' committee website (2).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="'bylaws' committee website (2).eml" Return-Path: Received: from truth.mccallie.org (mail.mccallie.org [209.140.58.34]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA26024 [xxxxxx] Tue, 23 Feb 1999 09:20:36 -0600 (CST) Received: from tstowell.mccallie.org [10.151.1.85] by truth.mccallie.org (SMTPD32-4.06) id A716CB103E8; Tue, 23 Feb 1999 10:19:50 EDT Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990223102225.007c5ca0@mail.mccallie.org> X-Sender: tstowell@mail.mccallie.org X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 10:22:25 -0500 To: "Lynn" , From: Tim Stowell Subject: 'bylaws' committee website Cc: "Bridgett Smith" , , , , , , , , , , , , Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: 10b19631269795516919b02086899920 I've left Jim off this mail as he is a member of the 'bylaws' committee. Thought though that in case you've not seen this site you might be interested in it: http://wcic.cioe.com/~gizmo/ Tim ------=_NextPart_000_0073_01BF7D2C.EB440600 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="'bylaws' committee website.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="'bylaws' committee website.eml" Return-Path: Received: from truth.mccallie.org (mail.mccallie.org [209.140.58.34]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id KAA22514 [xxxxxx] Tue, 23 Feb 1999 10:44:20 -0600 (CST) Received: from tstowell.mccallie.org [10.151.1.85] by truth.mccallie.org (SMTPD32-4.06) id AA7DA6320140; Tue, 23 Feb 1999 11:42:37 EDT Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990223114625.0088c830@mail.mccallie.org> X-Sender: tstowell@mail.mccallie.org X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 11:46:25 -0500 To: "Lynn" , From: Tim Stowell Subject: 'bylaws' committee website Cc: "Bridgett Smith" , , , , , , , , , , , , Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: 5494324e2d43b7b81727c8e85e7a11b5 I've written Jim and apologized. tim ------=_NextPart_000_0073_01BF7D2C.EB440600 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Census (This is very long but please read).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Census (This is very long but please read).eml" Return-Path: Received: from portal.txcyber.com (root@portal.cy-net.net [205.140.147.1]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA07534 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 00:54:31 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (ppp0.cy-net.net [205.140.147.100]) by portal.txcyber.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id BAA28649; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 01:08:37 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19990216005348.0175c570@txcyber.com> X-Sender: holt@txcyber.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 00:53:48 -0600 To: Betsy Mills , Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Bill Oliver , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs From: Trey Holt Subject: Census (This is very long but please read) In-Reply-To: <199902160335.VAA05672@portal.txcyber.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: 5a4ec0723fda00b95c53f50547e25e14 (First I am going to say that I have not included Kay to recieve this message but I do think that if the Archive rep is going to participate it is only fair for the Census Project rep to participate in this discussion.) This message is also meant for board discussion only and I please ask that it go no further than the members of this board at this time. Well now that this whole mess has become a very public battle this board needs to move very quickly and issue a very clear strongly worded recommendation concerning the relationship between "The USGenWeb Archives Project" and "The USGenWeb Census Project". The next thing I need to say is going to be tough for those of us that have been on the board and involved in this project for a long time but I think for us to get through this we all need to basically put everything that has happened in the past behind us and look at this thing from where we are at now both in an operational and a structural sense and recommend what makes the best sense for overall effeciency in getting records online and accessible to our researchers. Here is my take on this situation 1. THE CURRENT STRUCTURE The bylaws clearly state in Art II sec 2. "The USGenWeb Project shall also provide a "digital library" called "The USGenWeb Project Archives". In Art XIII Sec 2 The bylaws mention by name the special projects with members of the board as "The USGenWeb Archives Project", "The USGenWeb Census Project", and "The USGenWeb Tombstone Project". Linda Lewis and Kay Bradley were both on the last board when I chaired the bylaws committee. The bylaws were discussed for several months and at no time to the best of my knowledge did either party have a problem with this structure. There was considerable discussion about the number of reps the special projects should have on the board and in fact Linda and Kay were the main proponents for each of the large special projects having a representative. Many of the board thought that only 1 rep for all of the archives was enough but there was much discussion about the number of independent volunteers each special project had and it was agreed that each should have representation. The arguement has been made that many submitters are upset that they submitted their data to either "The USGenWeb Census Project" or "The USGenWeb Archives Project" and that they have not given permission for the files to be moved to the other. Well this arguement doesnt hold water as they say since the files were actually submitted to "The USGenWeb Project Archives" no matter what special project may have accepted them. 2. FUNCTIONALITY "The USGenWeb Census Project" functions as a means to organize, educate, motivate and recruit volunteers for the primary function of transcribing the original census images and placing them online so that they may be accessed free of charge to researchers. A new directory structure has been set up to organize the transcriptions so that it is clear as to what has been done and still needs to be done. "The USGenWeb Archives Project" has been recieving scanned images from SK publications and placing them online. The transcriptions of these images are then linked to them thus providing the researchers the original image and a trancription. "The USGenWeb Census Project" has been for quite some time and continues to notify the file managers of "The USGenWeb Archives Project" when new transcriptions are completed so they may be used with the images. To my knowledge "The USGenWeb Census Project" has not expressed any desires to get copies of these images. They are just trying to get the images transcribed. I am sure that once all of the census records have been transcribed the volunteers wont have any problem with all of the files being combined but that day is awhile down the road yet. Linda Lewis told me that at first the main reason to have the transcriptions in the same directory as the images was to make the images and transcriptions together. This is being done and in my opinion the only one complaining should be rootsweb and I dont hear them complaining, in fact they are helping. Linda also told me the other reason she wants the census stuff all in "The USGenWeb Archives Project" directory is to keep it all together. I'm not going to speculate on any motives for making this statement. I am only going to say that the job of transcribing the US Census has become a very large job. I have point blank asked Kay to confirm the structure of "The USGenWeb Project Archives" as laid out in the bylaws and she has confirmed that all data contributed by any projects make up "The USGenWeb Project Archives" no matter what directory they are in. I also have confirmed that the search engine being developed will globally search all directories at rootsweb in a single request so in my opinion the fact that the transcriptions are in a different directory and the fact that most of them are being copied to "The USGenWeb Archives Project" directory the search arguement is not a factor. 3. RECOMMENDATION I agree with Betsy's basic premis: (suggested language) --------- "We "The USGenWeb Project Advisory Board" want to remind all persons involved with "The USGenWeb Project" that all original records that are transcribed and submitted to any special project whether it be "The USGenWeb Archives Project", "The USGenWeb Census Project", "The USGenWeb Tombstone Project" or any other special project are a part of The USGenWeb Project's "digital library" known as "The USGenWeb Project Archives". The Board also strongly recommends that the special project named in the bylaws as "The USGenWeb Archives Project" leave the job of transcribing original US Census records and recruiting volunteers for the same purpose to the special project named in the bylaws as "The USGenWeb Census Project" and that "The USGenWeb Archives Project" should otherwise direct their efforts to transcribing the other vast volumes of original records that need to be transcribed in this country. "The USGenWeb Census Project" should continue to notify the file managers of "The USGenWeb Archives Project" when new transcriptions are completed so that these files may me included with original scanned images or other county file structures as may have been established or deemed neccessary. It is further the recommendation of this board that at such time "The USGenWeb Census Project" completes its mission and all US Census original records are transcribed and uploaded to the "digital library" known as "The USGenWeb Project Archives" that an assessment should be done of "The USGenWeb Project Archives" and any duplicated files be combined." --------- I also think that the first paragraph of this recommendation needs to be added to the special projects page of the website and that on http://www.usgenweb.org/projects/projects.html the bullets before the sections that describe the census and tombstone projects should be removed so that the equal status of all of the special projects as described in the bylaws is reflected everywhere on the national website. Sorry this was so long. I think I covered it all Thanks Trey Holt _ Bryan,Texas holt@txcyber.com | ICQ 5191379 The TXGenWeb Project State Coordinator | http://www.rootsweb.com/~txgenweb/ The Brazos Genealogical Assoc | Brazos Co TXGenWeb Site | http://www2.cy-net.net/~bga/ "The views expressed here are that of Trey Holt and not of The USGenWeb Project Advisory Board" At 09:16 PM 2/15/99 -0600, Betsy Mills wrote: >Kay is NOT cc:ed on this message for obvious reasons. I ask that no board >member forward a copy of this to her either. > >Okay, do we now ask Linda's supporters to forward their complaints about >Kay to this list??? This has to stop and the board has to stop it. This >is threatening to split the archives and this whole project right down the >middle. > >The only hope for this situation is for Kay to continue to do her own thing >and continue to submit a text copy for uploading to the appropriate county >directory in the archives and for Linda to remove the Archives Census >Project pages and to quit soliciting volunteers. The only other >alternative is to ask for the resignation of both Kay and Linda. > >This demanding to remove files from each others directories is ludicrous >and goes against the "free" use by the USGenWeb Project that is one of the >founding principals of this project. It must be all for one and one for >all or we are dead in the water, folks. > >Are we going to allow Kay and Linda to tear this project apart or are we >going to stop this now??? > >Betsy > > > ------=_NextPart_000_0073_01BF7D2C.EB440600 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Census Consensus (long but important).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Census Consensus (long but important).eml" Return-Path: Received: from dexter.ionia-mi.net (root@dexter.ionia-mi.net [207.142.187.7]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA09852 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 07:16:42 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (max1-l35.ionia-mi.net [207.142.187.118]) by dexter.ionia-mi.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id IAA17428; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 08:16:22 -0500 (EST) From: "Beth Wills" To: "Yvonne James-Henderson" , "Trey Holt" , "Tim Stowell" , "Megan Zurawicz" , "Lynn Watermann" , "Kim Harris Myers" , "Jim Powell" , "Ginger Cisewski" , "Celia Snyder" , "Bridgett" , "Bill Oliver" , "Betsy" , "Bonnie McVicar Briggs" Subject: Census Consensus (long but important) Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 08:19:14 -0500 Message-ID: <01be59ae$f3049d20$76bb8ecf@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 X-UIDL: ce723c63cab1683160f4d2a6e952754e This message has not been cc'd to Kay or Jan. In reading all of the messages over the last few days, I must admit that I have had a change of heart. My initial feeling was that the directory move for the census project was not a good one. It was done without the knowledge of a lot of people. But, in looking over the pages ( a lot in the last few days). I have come to the conclusion, like Trey, Betsey and Bill, that the census project has grown to the point where it probably needs to be a sub-project of the whole, not a sub-project of the archives. I really liked Trey's statement and feel that we should use it or one like it as a statement from the Board to the project members. I would like to see us formulate something that would officially move all of the census transcription files into ONE directly. I don't like the idea of them being in more than one place because I believe that this will spur on more of the "someone copied my work to put someplace else" complaints. I have been involved in transcribing census for quite some time, and I must admit that things were not updated very regularly until Kay took the bull by the horns and cleaned things up. And, I am disturbed by the fact that Linda's pages now solicite transcribers for the archives project seperate from those that are transcribing for the census project. That is really silly. If the archives LINK to the census project, we don't need to have the transcriptions in more than one place. This project has grown by leaps and bounds in the past few months and if you get a chance to really look through the website, there are HUNDREDS of people transcribing census records. We should protect this with all we have! Now, as far as the "contracts" that we have with SK, either the archives or the census project, I talked at great legnth with John just yesterday about this mess. John sent a message to both Kay and to Linda, which he cc'd to me. He feels that as long as there are going to be TWO census projects, that he will be able to continue to provide census CD's to the transcribers AS LONG AS THE TRANSCRIPTIONS ARE IN BOTH PLACES, the archives and the Census Project. But, also feels that if this gets out of hand that he will have to make a decision based on the best interest of the project. Here is what he wrote: ----SNIP---- > >I’ve been doing a lot of thinking the past couple of days (and yes, it does hurt! ) about (1) the two census Archives, and now (2) the two census transcription projects. > >Here’s the bottom line as far as supplying free copies of the S-K Publications books and CDs to transcribers is concerned: we will continue to supply these as requested by the USGenWeb Census Project SO LONG AS the transcriptions continue to be uploaded to both (1) the USGW Census Project Archives, and (2) the USGW Archives. > >I observe that the USGW Census Project main page continues to say that transcriptions will be uploaded to both Archives, and I’m pleased to see that the link to the USGW Archives has been restored. Kay has assured me that there is no plan to change the policy of placing the census transcriptions in both Archives. > >We will follow the same policy regarding the USGW Archives Census Project assignment of transcription volunteers. We will provide free books and CDs IF the transcriptions are to be uploaded to both (1) the USGW Archives and (2) the USGW Census Project Archives. It would appear from the USGW Archives Census Project page, however, that this is not the current plan and that transcriptions are to be uploaded only to the USGW Archives. > >On a more personal note, this split between Archives and Census has been distressing, and I think it’s having damaging effects on the whole effort. I have tried my hand at conflict resolution, but none too successfully, I must admit. :( > >If I am forced to accept the fact that there will be two separate projects and two separate archives, then I must do what I think is best for the researcher. In my judgment, that means that the same census transcriptions should be available to him/her in both locations. So S-K materials will be provided with that goal in mind. > >Let me know if any of you have questions, comments, etc. > >You all sure work hard. I appreciate all of you. > >Thanks, >John > ---SNIP---- Now, after talking with him, I feel very strongly that IF we, as the board, come up with a statement that delineates the structure and placement of the census transcriptions, that John will continue to donate free copies of the CD's for transcribers, as long as the project remains free and part of the USGenWeb Project. It also appears that the "contract" was initially with the Census Project and not with the Archives project. Now - we need to get to work and do something. First of all, we have a motion, second and discussion on the floor. We need to get to the business of voting and clear the adgenda so that we can deal with this. Thanks for taking the time to read this. Beth Beth Wills bwills@ionia-mi.net NE/NCentral Region Advisory Board C C Rep USGenWeb Project Ionia County MIGenWeb Coordinator http://www.rootsweb.com/~miionia Gladwin County MIGenWeb Coordinator http://www.rootsweb.com/~migladwi Saginaw County MIGenWeb Coordinator http://www.rootsweb.com/~misagina/Saginaw.html ------=_NextPart_000_0073_01BF7D2C.EB440600-- [xxxxxxx] Tue Feb 22 13:05:25 2000 [xxxxxxx] Received: from mail1.radix.net (mail1.radix.net [207.192.128.31]) by saltmine.radix.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA13009 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:05:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from [xxxxxx] ([xxxxxx] [199.184.119.1]) by mail1.radix.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA18270 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:05:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (nei-pm2-018.inetnebr.com [206.222.223.92]) by [xxxxxx] (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA08289; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:05:16 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <008101bf7d5f$4b615ba0$5cdfdece@default> [xxxxxxx] To: "merope" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:04:40 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_007E_01BF7D2D.00C6EBA0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_007E_01BF7D2D.00C6EBA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------=_NextPart_000_007E_01BF7D2D.00C6EBA0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Census Issue.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Census Issue.eml" Return-Path: Received: from pop01.globecomm.net (pop01.globecomm.net [206.253.129.185]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA27588 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 22:34:16 -0600 (CST) From: estral@switchboard.net Received: from Mine (pm3-6-ppp48.pcom.net [208.241.50.111]) by pop01.globecomm.net (8.9.0/8.8.0) with SMTP id XAA05264; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 23:33:44 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19990216215701.00b62ef0@mail.pcom.net> X-Sender: estral@mail.pcom.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 23:33:52 -0500 To: Beth Wills , "Celia G. Snyder" , "Bridgett Smith" , "Yvonne James-Henderson" , "Trey Holt" , gingerh@shawneelink.com, "Megan Zurawicz" , "Lynn Watermann" , "Kim Harris Myers" , "Kay Mason" , "Jim Powell" , "Jan Craven" , "Ginger Cisewski" , "Bill Oliver" , "Betsy" , "Tim Stowell" , "Bonnie" Subject: Census Issue Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: bdbabd72966be1b11d4b852be707ff78 Deliberately to all: I think the bottom line on this issue may be this: Can we get both Kay and Linda to agree to go to abitration by the board, and then agree to abide by the decision? When there was an issue recently that involved NYGenweb Project, that could not be resolved among the parties, we all agreed to abitration by the board. No one party to the issue came out of it feeling like they had been exonerated, or gotten their way, but we all felt like we had been listened to, and so far everyone is living up to the suggestions made. If Kay and Linda won't agree, then are we not just flapping in the wind for no reason? Kim Harris Myers estral@switchboard.net NYGenweb coordinator http://www.rootsweb.com/~nygenweb Cattaraugus Co, NY http://www.rootsweb.com/~nycattar/ Lemhi Co, ID http://www.rootsweb.com/~idlemhi/ Visit the Featured County of the month: Washington County NY http://www.rootsweb.com/~nywashin/ ------=_NextPart_000_007E_01BF7D2D.00C6EBA0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Census mess.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Census mess.eml" Return-Path: Received: from pimout3-int.prodigy.net (pimout3-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.59.211]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA25551 [xxxxxx] Sat, 27 Feb 1999 10:13:25 -0600 (CST) Received: from william (CHCGB111-08.splitrock.net [209.156.11.169]) by pimout3-int.prodigy.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA98602; Sat, 27 Feb 1999 11:12:51 -0500 Message-ID: <014301be626b$68c33980$a90b9cd1@william> From: "Ms. Piglet" To: "Linda Lewis" , Cc: , , , , , , , , , , , , , Subject: Census mess Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 10:08:20 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-UIDL: 26b6b4707206debb15f98dfd7ac5efd1 Linda said: >How can the USGenWeb Archives duplicate something they were already >doing? The USGenWeb Census Project apparently started in September 1998. >The USGenWeb Archives Census Project started in February 1997. > Linda, that's clearly not the case. The Census Project has *always* been called the USGenWeb Census Project, and any tracing of continuity will show that what Kay is doing is the same project. She took it out of the Archives directory structure without consulting anyone, and that was a wrong way to proceed, whether the end product was appropriate or not. You tried to get the Board to order Kay back into the Archives directory structure and that was not acted on. You then *started* a competing USGenWeb Archives Census Project. That much has been transparently clear to anyone watching this. You have now also stated essentially that the Archives reserves the right to leave the project at any time. This is a statement I've heard you imply repeatedly, and it's why I've ceased giving the Archives anything, storing data at the county site alone. But this is the first time I've heard you come out and say so. You've claimed in the past that this is precisely your point of conflict with Kay---that you believe she thinks she can take the Census Project away from USGW at any time she wishes to---and here you're showing that that is precisely your own approach to the Archives. Along with that, you're apparently stating that if the Board does not vote in the way *you* desire, you will ignore the Board....the same Board you are on. I find this deeply distressing, but this is precisely what I was referring to earlier when I stated to the Board that I did not believe the motion would solve anything. I strongly suspect that had the Board voted in the way Linda would like ("Kay must put everything back where she got it"), Kay would have ignored that directive. So now that we're here, what do we do about it? piglet (megan zurawicz) ICQ: 18429839 note: was pigolit@ix.netcom.com, now mspiglet@prodigy.net genealogy-- http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~piglet quilting-- http://pages.prodigy.net/mspiglet theatre-- http://members.aol.com/tupacratz/poohpix.htm ------=_NextPart_000_007E_01BF7D2D.00C6EBA0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Census Program.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Census Program.eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.networkone.net (root@mail.networkone.net [209.144.112.75]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA24235 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 22:20:19 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (assured-01-43.ln.networkone.net [209.144.118.44]) by mail.networkone.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id UAA22236; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 20:20:18 -0800 Message-Id: <199902170420.UAA22236@mail.networkone.net> From: "Kay Mason" To: Yvonne James-Henderson , Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , FEATHER2s@aol.com, estral@switchboard.net, holt@txcyber.com, "Waterman, Lynn*" , "Wills, Beth" , Betsy Mills , Kay Mason , "Celia G. Snyder" , wnoliver@glasscity.com, jpowelljr , Ms Piglet , Tim Stowell , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 20:14:36 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Census Program Reply-to: kmfkm@ptw.com Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT X-UIDL: 99e89330632c20d463bf5f45f3e2316a Phil Beshear, my CART programmer just received a request from one of Linda Lewis's people asking for a "clone" of his CART program, without a reference to "Kay's Census Project". He is going to refuse. However I thought that you would want to know about this. Thanks Kay Mason ------=_NextPart_000_007E_01BF7D2D.00C6EBA0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Census Project (2).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Census Project (2).eml" Return-Path: Received: from jubjub.wizard.com (jubjub.wizard.com [199.171.28.9]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA18849 [xxxxxx] Wed, 10 Feb 1999 15:57:19 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (pm2-1-087.wizard.com [208.211.48.87]) by jubjub.wizard.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id OAA03723; Wed, 10 Feb 1999 14:04:22 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199902102204.OAA03723@jubjub.wizard.com> From: "Bridgett Smith" To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 13:55:49 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Census Project Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) X-UIDL: 0f9cf885a24a87cf9bfca5388e7edb98 It seems to me that Tim should appoint 2 people who can be as unbiased as possible on this and let them handle all the input, and come up with a resolution to this problem. Duking it out here on the list, especially with Kay sitting there reading everything is not in good taste, IMNSHO. Bridgett Bridgett Smith SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region bascs@wizard.com *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* TNGenWeb State Coordinator http://www.tngenweb.org/ ------=_NextPart_000_007E_01BF7D2D.00C6EBA0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Census Project (3).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Census Project (3).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.1starnet.com (1starnet.com [207.243.104.17]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id VAA23662 [xxxxxx] Mon, 15 Feb 1999 21:21:02 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199902160321.VAA23662@[xxxxxx]> Received: from betsy [207.243.104.155] by mail.1starnet.com (SMTPD32-4.06) id A3F31350124; Mon, 15 Feb 1999 21:20:19 CST X-Sender: betsym@1starnet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0.1 Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 21:16:43 -0600 To: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Bill Oliver , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs From: Betsy Mills Subject: Census Project Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: bc9b63a9bc15281fa386c325253e0855 Kay is NOT cc:ed on this message for obvious reasons. I ask that no board member forward a copy of this to her either. Okay, do we now ask Linda's supporters to forward their complaints about Kay to this list??? This has to stop and the board has to stop it. This is threatening to split the archives and this whole project right down the middle. The only hope for this situation is for Kay to continue to do her own thing and continue to submit a text copy for uploading to the appropriate county directory in the archives and for Linda to remove the Archives Census Project pages and to quit soliciting volunteers. The only other alternative is to ask for the resignation of both Kay and Linda. This demanding to remove files from each others directories is ludicrous and goes against the "free" use by the USGenWeb Project that is one of the founding principals of this project. It must be all for one and one for all or we are dead in the water, folks. Are we going to allow Kay and Linda to tear this project apart or are we going to stop this now??? Betsy ------=_NextPart_000_007E_01BF7D2D.00C6EBA0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="CENSUS PROJECT (4).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="CENSUS PROJECT (4).eml" Return-Path: Received: from imo11.mx.aol.com (imo11.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.1]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA13309 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 21:40:03 -0600 (CST) From: CHAMBERSII@aol.com Received: from CHAMBERSII@aol.com by imo11.mx.aol.com (IMOv18.1) id MUPHa04329; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 22:13:54 +1900 (EST) Message-ID: <84df0ba6.36ca33f2@aol.com> Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 22:13:54 EST To: jcraven@usunwired.net Cc: bascs@snark.wizard.com, FEATHER2s@aol.co, estral@switchboard.ne, holt@txcyber.com, cestus3@inetnebr.com, bwills@ionia-mi.net, betsym@1starnet.com, kmfkm@ptw.com, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, wnoliver@glasscity.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, MSPIGLET@prodigy.net, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: CENSUS PROJECT Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 224 X-UIDL: 8df186395aff07ebd00d30bc3cfb57b6 Dear Board Member, I won't take your time with a long post, but want to say that I think Kay, Sue and all the volunteers on the Census Project are doing a great job. Kay has been so very patient, and caring, when I ask all those "dumb questions". I can't see what it matters where the census transcriptions are archived as long as everyone has free access to them. I was transcribing and proofreading in wonderfully ignorant bliss, not knowing the difference until all this came up. Please add my grateful support to Kay, Sue and all the other wonderful volunteers who are doing a fantastic job on this monunmental project. Myra Chambers Transcribing Jackson Co., AL ------=_NextPart_000_007E_01BF7D2D.00C6EBA0-- [xxxxxxx] Tue Feb 22 13:06:43 2000 [xxxxxxx] Received: from mail1.radix.net (mail1.radix.net [207.192.128.31]) by saltmine.radix.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA13102 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:06:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from [xxxxxx] ([xxxxxx] [199.184.119.1]) by mail1.radix.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA18598 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:06:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (nei-pm2-018.inetnebr.com [206.222.223.92]) by [xxxxxx] (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA08924; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:06:28 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <008e01bf7d5f$763345a0$5cdfdece@default> [xxxxxxx] To: "merope" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:05:52 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_008B_01BF7D2D.2B98D5A0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_008B_01BF7D2D.2B98D5A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------=_NextPart_000_008B_01BF7D2D.2B98D5A0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Census ProjectS (again, sigh).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Census ProjectS (again, sigh).eml" Return-Path: Received: from jubjub.wizard.com (jubjub.wizard.com [199.171.28.9]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA26775 [xxxxxx] Thu, 18 Feb 1999 13:57:12 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (pm3-3-109.wizard.com [208.211.54.109]) by jubjub.wizard.com (8.9.2/8.9.0) with SMTP id MAA22871; Thu, 18 Feb 1999 12:04:06 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199902182004.MAA22871@jubjub.wizard.com> From: "Bridgett Smith" To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 11:56:12 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Census ProjectS (again, ::sigh::) Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) X-UIDL: ad501774ec07adc1faeec17f02c55d2f I am very disturbed by the fact that apparently the archives file managers !AND! the transcribers with the USGW Census project are now at odds to some extent. It makes no sense to me to transcribe a census for the USGWC project and NOT allow it to be linked and/or copied to the USGW Archives. Isn't that what we stated in that motion, that this would be allowed and encouraged? I am NOT saying this is happening, but from what I have been reading that the Coordinators from each Project are not stressing this fact to the file managers/transcribers. In fact, *if* they are silent on this issue on their lists, then they need to tell their respective volunteers what is what. *IF* the transcribers from the USGWC project are not allowing linking and or copying of census to the archives area, as it seems to be the case from one transcriber, then in MNSHO we don't need folks like that around. This causes dissension in both projects and at this time, given what we've just been through, smoothing over feelings and such are needed more than dissension. Am I saying to get rid of this transcriber? NO I am not, what I am saying is that this transcriber needs to be told what is allowed and what isn't. If it is his copyrighted transcription that he will not allow linked or copied to the archives, it is my believe that it shouldn't be allowed elsewhere either. These two groups have got to learn to get along. They need to understand that one isn't trying to undermine the other, which is what I think both groups are thinking. The spirit of cooperation should be instilled in both groups. If not, then why not just get rid of the Cenus project altogether. Bridgett Bridgett Smith SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region bascs@wizard.com *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* TNGenWeb State Coordinator http://www.tngenweb.org/ ------=_NextPart_000_008B_01BF7D2D.2B98D5A0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Census Transcription list.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Census Transcription list.eml" Return-Path: Received: from relia.net (pluto.relia.net [207.173.156.10]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA20339 [xxxxxx] Mon, 15 Feb 1999 21:08:19 -0600 (CST) Received: from lllaird (p83.pr.relia.net [207.173.156.83]) by relia.net (8.8.7/8.6.12) with SMTP id UAA23927; Mon, 15 Feb 1999 20:05:50 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <003701be5959$8649d6a0$539cadcf@lllaird> From: "Lori Laird" To: , , , , , , , , , "Kay Mason" , , , , , , Subject: Census Transcription list Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 20:06:08 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-UIDL: c96afb5b0661312a1b85c56a1d6583f3 In reference to the recent spamming of the census transcription list: I am appalled that Linda Lewis would use the census transcription list to air her dirty laundry. Her email to the list was inflammatory to say the least and detracts from the mission of the USGenWeb. She spoke in circles, there were conflicting dates, and I had to read the email three times before I even realized what she was saying. Several transcribers mentioned not transcribing anymore, until someone could explain to them what was going on. I do believe Kay Mason and Sue Snoden have done everything in their power to "calm the waves." Still, that does not excuse Linda's behavior for posting to that list, nor Yvonne James-Henderson's for forwarding the email to the list to begin with. And even more disturbing was Holly Timm's email to the list regarding "her html". Where would this project be if everyone took down "their html" whenever there was a change, especially one as innocuous as a directory change? If the purpose of Linda's email was to ensure the Archives' inclusion in the census project, why would she include this in her email: "If you do not want to be part of the USGenWeb Archives Census Project, please let me know at mailto:cityslic@ix.netcom.com and your name will be removed from the pages." but put nothing about what to do if you do want to be included in the archives? It leads me to believe that the postings had absolutely nothing to do with "managing the Archives" and everything to do with "let's bash Kay." Please address this spamming issue as soon as possible, as it is a detriment to what we are all working toward. Lori Laird USGenWeb County Coordinator www.rootsweb.com/~negage/ ~ Gage Co., NE www.lofthouse.com/USA/Utah/weber/ ~ Weber Co., UT Support Rootsweb Today! www.rootsweb.com/how-to-subscribe.html/ ------=_NextPart_000_008B_01BF7D2D.2B98D5A0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Closing of Board-L.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Closing of Board-L.eml" Return-Path: Received: from jubjub.wizard.com (jubjub.wizard.com [199.171.28.9]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA22227 [xxxxxx] Thu, 18 Feb 1999 18:58:29 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (pm2-1-066.wizard.com [208.211.48.66]) by jubjub.wizard.com (8.9.2/8.9.0) with SMTP id RAA05888; Thu, 18 Feb 1999 17:05:30 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199902190105.RAA05888@jubjub.wizard.com> From: "Bridgett Smith" To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 16:57:37 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Closing of Board-L(?) Priority: normal In-reply-to: <3.0.3.32.19990218193402.006f1a48@mail.tds.net> References: <00fd01be5b88$3ec60fc0$680c9cd1@william> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) X-UIDL: 976264eb08d397627c84c0955a1aba21 On 18 Feb 99, at 19:34, Bonnie McVicar-Briggs wrote: > > > > At 03:47 PM 2/18/99 -0600, Ms. Piglet wrote: > >I'm still arguing for a closed Board list with published minutes rather > >than transcripts.....but I think I'm talking to myself. > > <<>>> > I agree the list should be closed and minutes published. I also think we > need agendas published so anyone who wishes to address an issue has the > opportunity to do so. JMO. Bonnie McVicar-Briggs mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net Megan and Bonnie, I would also like to see the Board list closed down and minutes published -- along with agenda being published somewhere (all regional lists?). The only thing tho is that my wish of closing Board-L may cause my ISP consternation at the increase of email messages being received if this is done. They have teasingly said that my daily mail is more than some of the commercial sites they host . In all seriousness folks, are we prepared for the flak that might occur over our closing this list down? Should we care? I don't know, really at this time. A read only type of GenConnect board probably would be good. Don't get me wrong I don't mind folks making disagreeing comments on whatever I say, but I want them NOT to take me out of context and then imply I meant something else. Or better yet not pay attention to what I am saying at all, and put their interpretation to what they "think" I am saying. Which is what I believe would happen if a GenConnect type board available for posting by anyone would turn into. Am I pessimistic, yep sure am. However, I would like to see a better way to communicate than all these addys at the top of every message. Bridgett Bridgett Smith SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region bascs@wizard.com *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* TNGenWeb State Coordinator http://www.tngenweb.org/ ------=_NextPart_000_008B_01BF7D2D.2B98D5A0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Comments Please.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Comments Please.eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.39]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id GAA16315 [xxxxxx] Fri, 26 Feb 1999 06:50:46 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.70.6.166]) by mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990226125014.RNS16471@worldnet.att.net>; Fri, 26 Feb 1999 12:50:14 +0000 Message-ID: <36D698C8.1F2FBC24@worldnet.att.net> Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 07:51:20 -0500 From: jpowelljr X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Tim Stowell CC: Bridgett Smith , FEATHER2s@aol.com, estral@switchboard.net, holt@txcyber.com, bwills@ionia-mi.net, Betsy Mills , Kay Mason , wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , cityslic@ix.netcom.com, hen1@IDT.NET, jcraven@usunwired.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu Subject: Comments Please References: <3.0.5.32.19990226014650.0089d4e0@mail.mccallie.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 7e85b1625693e8609562e46e14b9a87d Fellow Volunteers... I would like to share a couple of messages that I have lately sent to the Bylaws Committee... They are a little on the rambling side and they were, of course, sort of "Out of Order". I am looking for your comments as Volunteers of USGenWeb not Board Members.... Thanks, Jim BTW... Don't read anything into this... One comment by one individual provoked these comments... The thread was around the comment and actually had nothing to do with the present discussion. Jim Powell wrote.... This is in response to the thread that says everyone should be really involved. I do not see it that way. I guess a decent analogy of the way I believe things should work, might be an ant colony. Everybody (every ant) has their job to do and aren't concerned with the other ant's jobs. Some of the ants protect the colony from outside forces and internal strife (I know I'm pushing it with this part). But, we are those ants. We make it safe for all of the other ants to do their jobs, without the intrusion of politics. I agree in a perfect world everyone would care and everyone would vote. We do not live in a perfect world. I will gladly stand up for all of those Volunteers out their that work hard on their pages following the true intent of USGenWeb to gather and place online free genealogical resources, and do not wish to be burdened by all of this, that we choose to fall into. I do want to know what they are thinking and I will give them every opportunity that I can to communicate with me, but I will not condemn them for staying out of the politics. I will also stand up for those that wish to be more involved and are not allowed to be. We are a group of individuals (USGenWeb) tied together by a common goal. Honestly that goal has nothing to do with Bylaws or political situations. That was invented by the type of individual that we are and we need to tend to it, with the freedom of all of the individuals in our project in mind... Especially those that wish to do the best they can with their counties or states and stay out of the politics, if it wasn't for them, I wouldn't be here nor would I have run for the Board. Jim ------=_NextPart_000_008B_01BF7D2D.2B98D5A0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="DBS.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="DBS.eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.39]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA05820 [xxxxxx] Sat, 20 Feb 1999 18:25:46 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.67.128.39]) by mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990221002514.BLKL29836@worldnet.att.net>; Sun, 21 Feb 1999 00:25:14 +0000 Message-ID: <36CF5222.87DDD699@worldnet.att.net> Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 19:24:02 -0500 From: William N Oliver Reply-To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net Organization: NEGenWeb/OHGenWeb/USGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,nl,de-CH,de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Betsy Mills CC: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Kay Mason , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , Linda Russell Lewis Subject: DBS References: <199902190247.SAA06287@snark.wizard.com> <36CCBA8D.DFFEC1CD@worldnet.att.net> <19990219233256.LKSO3297@mail.1starnet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 768531304d07c0ca48edadb4ddc817ed Good Evening Good Folks, If you have not read the DBS for today [and I really am opening myself here to admitting that I occasionally visit and that is not something I really wish to let her know] it has a most interesting report among the others. How does Teresa know that there is a grievance against Linda and that Linda is "scrambling" around to get a counter grievance filed?? How is she able to quote messages that are supposedly only going to the Board?? The grievance was not known outside this Board and the person filing it. Is someone here wanting to derail the Board again??? I sure can't see the advantage of closing Board-L, board business is apparently being leaked for purposes unknown and for private agendas. Bill -- ------=_NextPart_000_008B_01BF7D2D.2B98D5A0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Discussion.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Discussion.eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.networkone.net (root@mail.networkone.net [209.144.112.75]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA18295 [xxxxxx] Sat, 27 Feb 1999 12:11:13 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (assured-01-114.ln.networkone.net [209.144.118.115]) by mail.networkone.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id KAA04428; Sat, 27 Feb 1999 10:10:49 -0800 Message-Id: <199902271810.KAA04428@mail.networkone.net> From: "Kay Mason" To: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Kay Mason , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Bill Oliver , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , Linda Russell Lewis , Betsy Mills Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 10:07:55 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Discussion Reply-to: kmfkm@ptw.com Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT X-UIDL: b090677252826fff6e206c5d6457b477 Linda says that I refuse to talk to her.. however... When the conflict first began between the two of us, I asked Brian Leverich for assistance and comments. He made some suggestions which I found workable at that time; however, apparently the Linda did not agree. Brian then stepped out. Linda continued to cover the same ground over and over, and over again. All of her arguments were pre-ByLaws, which changed the organization of the USGenWeb Project Archives, and made the the Archival Projects separate and equal. This approach does not and will not work for a progressive future of USGenWeb Project or its Archival Projects. Whe it became apparent that the discussions were stalemated, I terminated the fruitless conversations. Life is too short and the future is already here and there is no reason to continue arguing pointlessly without some sort of solution-seeking goals. Thanks, Kay USGenWeb Census Project http://www.usgenweb.org/census/ http://www.usgenweb.com/census http://www.usgenweb.net/census/ Montgomery County Mississippi http://www.rootsweb.com/~msmontgo/ Rock County Nebraska http://www.rootsweb.com/~nerock/ ------=_NextPart_000_008B_01BF7D2D.2B98D5A0-- [xxxxxxx] Tue Feb 22 13:08:29 2000 [xxxxxxx] Received: from mail1.radix.net (mail1.radix.net [207.192.128.31]) by saltmine.radix.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA13223 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:08:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from [xxxxxx] ([xxxxxx] [199.184.119.1]) by mail1.radix.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA18940 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:08:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (nei-pm2-018.inetnebr.com [206.222.223.92]) by [xxxxxx] (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA09789; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:08:16 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <009b01bf7d5f$b6807420$5cdfdece@default> [xxxxxxx] To: "merope" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:07:40 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0098_01BF7D2D.6BE60420" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0098_01BF7D2D.6BE60420 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------=_NextPart_000_0098_01BF7D2D.6BE60420 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Enough is enough.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Enough is enough.eml" Return-Path: Received: from dexter.ionia-mi.net (root@dexter.ionia-mi.net [207.142.187.7]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA15212 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 19:49:31 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (max0-l18.ionia-mi.net [207.142.187.53]) by dexter.ionia-mi.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id UAA20166; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 20:48:54 -0500 (EST) From: "Beth Wills" To: "Yvonne James-Henderson" , "Trey Holt" , "Tim Stowell" , "Megan Zurawicz" , "Lynn Watermann" , "Kim Harris Myers" , "Jim Powell" , "Ginger Cisewski" , "Celia Snyder" , "Bridgett" , "Bonnie McVicar Briggs" , "Bill Oliver" , "Betsy" , "Kay Mason" , "Jan Craven" Subject: Enough is enough Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 20:51:54 -0500 Message-ID: <01be5a18$185214e0$35bb8ecf@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 1 X-MSMail-Priority: High X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 X-UIDL: 54ea610823853a2e99fe20156c2de3ef Since September I have weathered the comings and goings of a number of members of this board, and I have taken my share of the pot shots. I have learned to deal with a variety of issues, but what I can not deal with is the fact that we aren't doing anything! We have been sitting on this census vs. archives thing for 8 DAYS! During this time we have delt with a few little issues like logos and such, but we have not addressed the biggest issue that stands to tear this project apart. We have several motions on the table, we are in the middle of one vote and still nothing is being done! Things are such a mess it is a wonder that anyone can tell what is going on. I can't stand it - it is driving me nuts - and it has driven me beyond effectiveness. Effective immediately - I resign my position on the board. Sorry, Kay, you ran the NE / NC run off election for nothing because now the number 2 person on the ballot can have my spot. Good luck to all of you! It has been a pleasure knowing and working with you all. Beth ------=_NextPart_000_0098_01BF7D2D.6BE60420 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Escalation.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Escalation.eml" Return-Path: Received: from jubjub.wizard.com (jubjub.wizard.com [199.171.28.9]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA08744 [xxxxxx] Sat, 27 Feb 1999 11:19:23 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (pm3-3-095.wizard.com [208.211.54.95]) by jubjub.wizard.com (8.9.2/8.9.0) with SMTP id JAA16212; Sat, 27 Feb 1999 09:19:03 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199902271719.JAA16212@jubjub.wizard.com> From: "Bridgett Smith" To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 09:18:40 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Escalation Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) X-UIDL: f19c36cde1e3bfc308840ccc67cf6b0e This is sort of responding to Yvonne's last message. To begin with if there are secret meetings on Mirc I know nothing about them. The last time I was on IRC was the night I introduced Linda to the bingozone . The reason I was there that time was to see if Nancy Trice was on line to find out about a message she posted to the SC mailing list regarding TNGenWeb and its bylaws. I didn't stay very long, I never do. If I have failed to say in the past that I thought Linda has done an admirable job with the archives, I stand admonished. The task of starting up the archives and getting it to the point where it is today was a monumental one. My hat is off to her. My original posting which started all this discussion was not meant to bash Linda, but to find out exactly what she meant by her post to the SE/MA list. Could I have asked her privately? Yes, I probably could have -- but then I was also trying to see if I was the only one to take her message the way I perceived it to be. I wanted to know if I needed to rethink my opinion of the message. As I stated in my original message, everyone does not read the same post in the same way, and different "messages" are read into the same post. >From there this discussion has escalated to where it is today, which indicates to me that there is a definite problem somewhere within the Archives project. Mixed messages are being sent out, and questions are not being answered directly, they are being skirted around, if answered at all (and not only on Linda's part). No one came to the board, not Kay -- not Linda, NO ONE -- to find out, to complain or advise us of any rift was growing between those two people which may have reprocussions on the entire project. Both Kay and Linda are equal in being wrong on this matter [[please remember anything I say starting with this paragraph is *my* opinion only]]. Because they didn't bring this to the board's attention when all of this started, we are at the point where we are today. Yvonne states: >>>> She [Linda] has a REAL complaint here and not one of you addressed her complaint, but were quick to take sides and label Linda a troublemaker.<<<<< What is her complaint? That we've questioned some of her remarks made in posts??? That Kay sneaked off with the Archives and the Archive volunteers? When/if Kay did so why wasn't this complaint brought up to us when this occurred, not 6 months later [time frame derived from a post by Linda saying the USGWP Census Project apparently created in Sept 1998]? What I am really distressed about now is a post made by Linda yesterday: >>>> I guess they are still a part of The USGenWeb Project, until the majority of the volunteers vote that they are not.<<<< This statement really scares me. And also is in contradiction to a previous statement made by Linda that the USGWP Archives Project is not "owned" by the USGW Project, but the submitters of information to it -- seems to me the volunteers shouldn't even have a say so in this matter but all of the submitters. When this situation came up right after the elections, I suggested that this should be taken to a grievance committee, and I still think it should have been. I am not saying the outcome would have been any different, but I believe 2 or 3 people could have gotten down to the nitty gritty of this situation a whole lot better than 15. Bridgett Bridgett Smith SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region bascs@wizard.com *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* TNGenWeb State Coordinator http://www.tngenweb.org/ ------=_NextPart_000_0098_01BF7D2D.6BE60420 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Explain to me please.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Explain to me please.eml" Return-Path: Received: from jubjub.wizard.com (jubjub.wizard.com [199.171.28.9]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA29409 [xxxxxx] Fri, 26 Feb 1999 13:50:24 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (pm2-1-083.wizard.com [208.211.48.83]) by jubjub.wizard.com (8.9.2/8.9.0) with SMTP id LAA08982; Fri, 26 Feb 1999 11:49:55 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199902261949.LAA08982@jubjub.wizard.com> From: "Bridgett Smith" To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 11:49:35 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Explain to me please Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) X-UIDL: d146ae86804cfed2e54ee93b0087c399 WHAT is the relationship of the USGenWeb Project Archives and the USGW Project Census Project? Is there no connection anymore? Has that been a finalized split, or what? I can't even explain and/or help my own cc's when they ask me questions anymore about the census project/archives project -- it seems so convoluted. However, I will tell you how *I* perceive this situation. The USGenWeb Digital Library is known as the USGenWeb Project Archives. There are several sub-projects within the Digital Library, which *IMNSHO includes* the USGWP Census Project, USGWP Tombstone Project, yada yada yada. It does NOT state anywhere in our bylaws that the Digital Library has to be on the domain www.rootsweb.com nor www.usgenweb.com/org/net -- therefore *ALL* facets of this Digital Library is part of the USGWP Archives. Given that fact, all file managers in any of the projects within the Digital Library, no matter what project they are connected with, *are* responsible for files being submitted. In the Policy regarding the Census project that the board passed it stated that the Census Project file managers were responsible for notifiying the archives file managers of new files that were uploaded. Those archive file managers were to get those files and upload to archives. >From the policy: "The USGenWeb Census Project" should continue to notify the file managers of "The USGenWeb Archives Project" when new transcriptions are completed so that these files may be included with original scanned images or other county file structures as may have been established or deemed neccessary. HOWEVER, Linda's comment: > A file submitted, for instance to a county coordinator only, for > uploading to their site, is not part of the USGenWeb Archives. Files > residing on other servers or even on Rootsweb, but not in the >above directories, are not part of the USGenWeb Archives. To me is very misleading and wrong in my book. also: > When a file is received, the archivists/file managers make a >commitment to the submitter that the file will be stored permanently >in the USGenWeb Archives for the benefit of researchers, and that >the data will not be sold nor will any fees be charged to access the >files. The Archives volunteers cannot be responsible for files >located elsewhere. I agree that the archive volunteers can't be responsible for files located elsewhere, as it isn't their responsibility, it is the sub-projects volunteers responsiblity and those sub-projects are also part of the Digital Library, no matter what domain it sits on. This implies that if a person submits data to any sub-project within the Digital Library that isn't in the two URL's you gave, that they could be subject to be sold and fees charged. The implication is there and therefore putting down the USGWP Census Project and "thumbing the nose." and. . . >>> Did he mean that the Archives will not upload any census files unless they were recruited by Kay's project? That is not going to happen.<<<< It is the USGWP Census Project, not Kay's project, she is just the coordinator. Like you are just the coordinator for the USGWP Archives Project. Both projects are "owned" by the USGenWeb Project, not an individual. However, from past messages received I believe that the the Census Project is notifying the Archives Project of any transcriptions that come in and letting the file managers know where to go download the file. Are your folks reciprocating? I haven't heard anything on this and so I don't want to assume that it is not being done. If any of the above of my thoughts are wrong please clarify and explain to me why I am wrong -- but do so to everyone, not just to me. Thanks, Bridgett Bridgett Smith SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region bascs@wizard.com *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* TNGenWeb State Coordinator http://www.tngenweb.org/ ------=_NextPart_000_0098_01BF7D2D.6BE60420 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Formal Complaint.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Formal Complaint.eml" Return-Path: Received: from alastair.tir.com (alastair.tir.com [216.40.128.69]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA05398 [xxxxxx] Mon, 15 Feb 1999 20:11:01 -0600 (CST) Received: from rkeason (port46.mico20.tir.com [216.40.139.231]) by alastair.tir.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id VAA14908; Mon, 15 Feb 1999 21:07:39 -0500 (EST) From: "Ron & Kathy" To: "Yvonne James-Henderson" , "Trey Holt" , "Megan Z" , "Lynn Waterman" , "Kim Harris-Myers" , "Jim Powell" , "Jan Craven" , "Ginger Cisewski" , "Celia Snyder" , "Bridgett Smith" , "Bonnie McVicar-Briggs" , "Bill Oliver" , "Betsy Mills" , "Beth Wills" , "Kay Mason" , "Tim Stowell" Subject: Formal Complaint Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 21:06:29 -0500 Message-ID: <01be5950$f72b0500$e78b28d8@rkeason> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_006D_01BE5927.0E54FD00" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 X-UIDL: ffe9c4d9d344981d8517a4fdbe7368be This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_006D_01BE5927.0E54FD00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit USGW Board, My name is Ron Eason, I am the CC of Lapeer County, MI. and Heard County, GA.. I am the state coordinator for CA., GA., IL., and temp. SC., for The USGenWeb Census Project. I am also an Assistant National Coordinator for The USGenWeb Census Project. I would like to herein file a complaint against Linda Lewis, National Coordinator of The USGenWeb Archives Project, and against the Archives Project, et al. It is my belief that Linda Lewis did willfully and knowingly cause to have sent to the mailing list of The USGenWeb Census Project, a letter wherewith she attempted to cause confusion and discord amongst the members and volunteers of that mailing list by inference and lies. In one case, caused by that letter, a volunteer requested that their transcription be removed from the pages of The USGenWeb Census Project. This is not in keeping with good relations and harmony within the whole of the USGW Project. It is my concern that in her continued efforts to control The USGenWeb Census Project and bring it back under foot of the Archives Project that she will in all intents and purposes destroy the infrastructure, the volunteer base and overall integrity that The USGenWeb Census Project has built under the direction of it's National Coordinator, Kay Mason. The USGenWeb Census Project has continued to provide the Archives Project with the upload information on all files, in keeping with the desires of the Archives to be the USGW repository of ALL information. However, they have now started an active campaign to totally duplicate every page of The USGenWeb Census Project, using the old web pages made available to them by Holly Timm. http://www.rootsweb.com/~usgenweb/census/states/illinois.htm The above is the address of my state of Illinois, with my name on it, which I have prior to this writing, asked to be removed from. Now, I would ask.....Is this necessary? I hesitate to use the term, "Power Struggle" but for a lack of a better description, it seems that Linda Lewis is determined that she will have "a census project" at any cost. Whether it is damaging to The USGenWeb Census Project, or to The USGW Project itself. And I assure you that the volunteers are already upset just from the letter that was posted. I dare say that if something isn't done to stop what Linda is trying to do to this Project, it will probably set The USGenWeb Census Project back at least a year and the repercussions will be no less than the fiasco that recently was transpiring on the ALL-list. I ask each and every member of this Board to ask yourself these questions. "Is what's happening in the best interest of the USGW Project as a whole?" "Is it necessary for there to be a shadow project within the archives project?" "Is it necessary for the directory of The USGenWeb Census Project to be inside of the Archives Project?" "Is it wrong for The USGenWeb Census Project to want to have it's own directory and it's own people that process the census files and upload them?" I could go on, but I think you understand the picture. There is a problem ladies and gentlemen and it needs to have action immediately before damage is done that will be very hard to repair. Would it be too much to ask for a temporary "stay" placed against the Archives Project from putting any more pages up and removing the ones that have been put up, in direct competition against The USGenWeb Census Project? At least until you have had a chance to address this situation? I hope that your decision will be swift and in the best interest of the USGW Project. Thank you, Ron Eason rkeason@tir.com cc: entire board attachment: letter to "Census-L" (dated 2/9/99) ------=_NextPart_000_006D_01BE5927.0E54FD00 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: [CENSUS-L] USGenWeb Archives Census Project Content-Disposition: attachment X-Envelope-From: CENSUS-L-request@rootsweb.com Tue Feb 9 16:45:12 1999 Received: from bl-30.rootsweb.com (bl-30.rootsweb.com [207.113.245.30]) by alastair.tir.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA09883 for ; Tue, 9 Feb 1999 16:45:04 -0500 (EST) Received: (from slist@localhost) by bl-30.rootsweb.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA11092; Tue, 9 Feb 1999 13:42:06 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 9 Feb 1999 13:42:06 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <36C0AC9B.8979AD9D@idt.net> Date: Tue, 09 Feb 1999 16:46:03 -0500 From: Yvonne James-Henderson Organization: Visit Daisy's Roots! http://www.rootsweb.com/~daisy/1daisy.htm X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Old-To: census-l@rootsweb.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [CENSUS-L] USGenWeb Archives Census Project Resent-Message-ID: <"HhV1pC.A.QpC.RuKw2"@bl-30.rootsweb.com> Resent-From: CENSUS-L@rootsweb.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2316 X-Loop: CENSUS-L@rootsweb.com To: CENSUS-L@rootsweb.com Precedence: list Errors-To: CENSUS-L-request@rootsweb.com Resent-Sender: CENSUS-L-request@rootsweb.com Forwarded by request of Linda Lewis Subject: USGenWeb Archives Census Project Date: Tue, 09 Feb 1999 13:16:54 -0800 From: Linda Russell Lewis Organization: USGenWeb Archives, VAGenWeb To: hen1@idt.net In February 1997, the USGenWeb Archives volunteers created the USGenWeb Archives Census Project. The goal was to eventually get every census record transcribed and uploaded to the Archives for free access to all. The files would be included in the Archives search engine, so researchers would be able to find their ancestors, elusive or not. Ken Hollingsworth answered the call to coordinate the effort. We started out by concentrating on the year 1850 and software for data entry was created by John Rigdon (CTA). The software created a text file as well as a .dbf file that is planned to be used with a search engine connected to the actual image of a census microfilm page. As volunteers started signing up, we discovered that many were interested in working on other years, so all years were opened up. The only requirement from the volunteer transcribers was that a copy of the text be uploaded to the USGenWeb Archives for permanent storage, and with free access. The copyright remained with the transcriber. Efforts to identify existing transcriptions started, and links put in place, or purchasing info for those already published in book form. Phil Beshear was recruited by Ken to improve CTA and include additional years in the software. Phil wrote a brand new program, CART, and has updated the software depending on our needs, adding html export, etc. John Schunk of S-K Publications was contacted and agreed to provide the census books available to volunteer transcribers. In August 1997, S-K contracted with the USGenWeb Archives to provide census images as they become available (at not cost as long as they were available for free access to researchers; Rootsweb agreed to provide the servers to store the images). http://www.rootsweb.com/~usgenweb/cen_img.htm In September 1997, Kay Mason, current coordinator, decided to change the name of the project, from the USGenWeb Archives Census project, to the USGenWeb Census Project. The files provided by the volunteers are not being uploaded to the USGenWeb Archives by the USGenWeb Census Project any longer. A separate archives has been created, and without notification to the volunteers (copyright holders), or permission obtained, files have been uploaded there. Since the creation of the USGenWeb Archives, we have made a commitment to researchers and file submitters. We only upload files by permission, and try to make research as easy as possible for the genealogist. When we started recruiting volunteers for the census project, there was a clear understanding that their work would not be abused or treated frivously. It is because of the recent events, we would like for the volunteers to know that the USGenWeb Archives Census Project is still active, and has the same goals as were set in February 1997. Due to the unfortunate turn of events, some volunteers, who thought they were volunteering for the USGenWeb Archives, are now part of the new project. If you do not want to be part of the USGenWeb Archives Census Project, please let me know at mailto:cityslic@ix.netcom.com and your name will be removed from the pages. http://www.rootsweb.com/~usgenweb/census/ Kay Mason, who was convinced to take over from Ken in February 1998, has done a fantastic job in organizing the census project. It's unfortunate that she decided to remove the project, started by the USGenWeb Archives volunteers, from its "home." The USGenWeb Archives Census Project was the first of a list of specialized projects planned by the Archives. The USGenWeb Archives Pension Project is getting underway, and announcements will soon go out about that. Thank you all for the work you do as a volunteer. The ultimate goal is to help researchers (which includes each of us). Linda ==== CENSUS Mailing List ==== Census Help Pages and other important Census Project information at; http://www.usgenweb.org/census/info/ Help keep free Genealogy information on the Internet, join Rootsweb Today! http://www.rootsweb.com/rootsweb/how-to-subscribe.html ------=_NextPart_000_006D_01BE5927.0E54FD00-- ------=_NextPart_000_0098_01BF7D2D.6BE60420 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Fw [USGENWEB-DISCUSS-L] Board Action.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Fw [USGENWEB-DISCUSS-L] Board Action.eml" Return-Path: Received: from dexter.ionia-mi.net (root@dexter.ionia-mi.net [207.142.187.7]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id EAA00761 [xxxxxx] Sat, 13 Feb 1999 04:19:39 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (max0-l35.ionia-mi.net [207.142.187.70]) by dexter.ionia-mi.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id FAA06260; Sat, 13 Feb 1999 05:19:06 -0500 (EST) From: "Beth Wills" To: "Tim Stowell" , "Betsy" , "Bill Oliver" , "Bridgett" , "Celia Snyder" , "Ginger Cisewski" , "Jan Craven" , "Jim Powell" , "Kay Mason" , "Kim Harris Myers" , "Lynn Watermann" , "Megan Zurawicz" , "Trey Holt" , "Yvonne James-Henderson" Subject: Fw: [USGENWEB-DISCUSS-L] Board Action Date: Sat, 13 Feb 1999 05:21:19 -0500 Message-ID: <01be573a$98800900$46bb8ecf@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 X-UIDL: c52392ad9f33a98ff9f6c0ba3bd9befb -----Original Message----- From: Don Tharp To: USGENWEB-DISCUSS-L@rootsweb.com Date: Friday, February 12, 1999 10:46 PM Subject: [USGENWEB-DISCUSS-L] Board Action >Everything is quite? Is the board in session? By my count there is plenty >to be done, some from the session prior to elections. Listed below are some >of the items that are still open from prior sessions. > >The grievance concerning Kenny Thomas has never been resolved. Action was >voted to be accomplished, but action was never implemented. Kansas is still >without its own selected archive file manager. > >A motion was approved to form a grievance committee. Is there such a >committee? One board member recently stated that the board had no authority >to review grievances. What is the status? > >Nancy Trice is still listed as the administrator of the .org and .net >domains. Shouldn't that be changed to Tim Stowell? > >The position of secretary was tabled, this motion should be opened, >discussed and closed one way or the other to clear the motion. Perhaps we >need a secretary to keep track of all the open motions and to get the motion >information to the web masters. > >The By Laws review committee was tabled to be further discussed among the >board in a medium that would allow for sufficient reflection. The medium >wasn't spelled out, but has any discussion been held? Will there be? > >Also tabled was discussion of whether or not a RootsWeb representative >should be part of The USGenWeb Advisory Board. Should this be allowed to >drag on? > >Is there any action to be taken in the future concerning incorporation of >USGW as a non profit organization? Seems the discussion of the .com domain >is hanging until that is settled. When are we to become a bona fide >organization? > >The web pages for the Motions/Votes has not been updated since December 23, >1998. Haven't there been motions and votes since then? > >Don >det@fn.net >Chautauqua County, KS CC > > > > >==== USGENWEB-DISCUSS Mailing List ==== >Help save an endangered species...BANDWIDTH ! >When replying to a message please cut as much > as possible from the original message. >Have questions? Problems? Contact....me at > rmaggard@sun-spot.com > >Beth Wills bwills@ionia-mi.net NE/NCentral Region Advisory Board C C Rep USGenWeb Project Ionia County MIGenWeb Coordinator http://www.rootsweb.com/~miionia Gladwin County MIGenWeb Coordinator http://www.rootsweb.com/~migladwi Saginaw County MIGenWeb Coordinator http://www.rootsweb.com/~misagina/Saginaw.html ------=_NextPart_000_0098_01BF7D2D.6BE60420 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Fwd Re A query I tried to post.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Fwd Re A query I tried to post.eml" Return-Path: Received: from staff2.cso.uiuc.edu (root@staff2.cso.uiuc.edu [128.174.5.53]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA24808 [xxxxxx] Sun, 14 Feb 1999 19:08:37 -0600 (CST) Received: from [130.126.25.53] (bayou-89.slip.uiuc.edu [130.126.24.222]) by staff2.cso.uiuc.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA10324; Sun, 14 Feb 1999 19:08:06 -0600 (CST) X-Sender: cgsnyder@staff.uiuc.edu Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 14 Feb 1999 19:10:34 -0600 To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, bascs@snark.wizard.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net From: "Celia G. Snyder" Subject: Fwd: Re: A query I tried to post X-UIDL: c0038ca8e1da54b3fd50f317130b1950 Robin Carvallo wrote to me via the national website. She was asking about a county that would not post her surnames unless she had at least 3 generations of information in that county. I asked her to identify the county and she forwarded the following information and email interchange. I am forwarding for your information and action if deemed appropriate. Celia PS: I checked the Allen Parish website and they have a surname register (which is where Robin wanted to submit her surnames) and also uses GenConnect for queries. >From: RCarvallo@aol.com >Date: Sun, 14 Feb 1999 18:19:36 EST >To: cgsnyder@uiuc.edu >Mime-Version: 1.0 >Subject: Re: A query I tried to post > >Hi Celia, > >I too am associated with the USGenWeb Project for Southern California. I have >a cemetery listing for South Bay California and am in the processing of >submitting cemetery information for at least 5 cemeteries for Louisiana which >information was handwritten in 1935. I do look ups, help where I can, >whenever I can. I belong to 10 Historical and Genealogy Societies in >Louisiana and 2 here in California. I believe the reason I am so dedicated is >because of my lack of ability to find my own family, so, to fill the need >inside of me, I help others. > >I am attaching the reply to my query in regards to why I should have at least >3 generations before I can even have my surname on Allen Parish, Louisiana. > >Please let me know what you think. > >Thanks a million, > >Your Friend in the Gen World > >Robin Carvallo > >(See below) > >Hi Robin, > >Basically, there are two reasons; (1) Because when I first started the site, >I had feedback from people who were upset that they wasted time contacting >other people who only had 1 or 2 generations of information, the same that >they had. That's why I now recommend that people also use the GenConnect >System to "register" their surname if they have less than 3 generations of >information. An added benefit using the GenConnect System, anyone can do a >"global" search on any surname, for any state, parish/county, etc. In fact, >since the GenConnect System is doing so well, I am thinking that we do not >need a "Surname Page" any longer. I've noticed that other County/Parish >Coordinators are starting to delete their Surname sites. (2) Because I have >very limited time to keep changing the Web pages. (It has been 2 months >since I've had time to change the pages.) Some of the Coordinators of the >other Parish/County pages are retired or they are actually a committee of >local genealogy organizations and have lots of time or help. Not only do I >volunteer to coordinate this one, but also another one, plus, I have a full >time job, children, and I travel a great deal. The State Coordinator is >always looking for additional volunteers to help with all the Parish and/or >Parish Archives site. > >Also, I plan to link to another great Surname site. It is the GenForum >Surname site sponsored by FamilyTree Maker. (http://www.genforum.com/) The >server seems to be quite busy at the moment and didn't have a chance to see >if the MENARD surname is included in their forum, but if you haven't looked >at this site, I highly recommend it. > >I hope this helps explain my reasons. Please let me know if there is >anything else I can do for you. > >Kim Stracener Zapalac >LAGenWeb's Allen & LaSalle Parishes Coordinator > > > > > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: RCarvallo@aol.com [mailto:RCarvallo@aol.com] >> Sent: Saturday, February 13, 1999 9:33 AM >> To: allenparish@geocities.com >> Subject: Re: Surname Menard >> >> >> Why is there a limit of 3? >> > > > >----------------------- Headers -------------------------------- >Return-Path: >Received: from rly-yb01.mx.aol.com (rly-yb01.mail.aol.com > ------=_NextPart_000_0098_01BF7D2D.6BE60420-- [xxxxxxx] Tue Feb 22 13:09:07 2000 [xxxxxxx] Received: from mail1.radix.net (mail1.radix.net [207.192.128.31]) by saltmine.radix.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA13308 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:09:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from [xxxxxx] ([xxxxxx] [199.184.119.1]) by mail1.radix.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA19036 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:09:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (nei-pm2-018.inetnebr.com [206.222.223.92]) by [xxxxxx] (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA10093; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:08:55 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00a601bf7d5f$cdc702c0$5cdfdece@default> [xxxxxxx] To: "merope" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:08:19 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00A3_01BF7D2D.832C92C0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00A3_01BF7D2D.832C92C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------=_NextPart_000_00A3_01BF7D2D.832C92C0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Have a .eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Have a .eml" Return-Path: Received: from jubjub.wizard.com (jubjub.wizard.com [199.171.28.9]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA07631 [xxxxxx] Sat, 13 Feb 1999 17:16:39 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (pm3-3-104.wizard.com [208.211.54.104]) by jubjub.wizard.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id PAA24521; Sat, 13 Feb 1999 15:25:01 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199902132325.PAA24521@jubjub.wizard.com> From: "Bridgett Smith" To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net Date: Sat, 13 Feb 1999 15:15:53 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Have a ?? Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) X-UIDL: ae45e8256fefa6c54f2d2f7ff85fda9f First of all welcome Bonnie I have someone who would like to adopt a county named, Stephanie J. Ebel, she says that she was a cc at one time in OH -- anyone know anything bout her? Bridgett Bridgett Smith SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region bascs@wizard.com *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* TNGenWeb State Coordinator http://www.tngenweb.org/ ------=_NextPart_000_00A3_01BF7D2D.832C92C0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="How I see the project.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="How I see the project.eml" Return-Path: Received: from u1.farm.idt.net (root@u1.farm.idt.net [169.132.8.10]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA00840 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 00:03:30 -0600 (CST) Received: from idt.net (ip51.austin17.tx.pub-ip.psi.net [38.27.175.51]) by u1.farm.idt.net (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA07272; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 01:03:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <36C90565.BAEC9E19@idt.net> Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 23:43:01 -0600 From: Veda Mendoza X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.06 [en] (Win98; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Trey Holt , Kay Mason , Yvonne James-Henderson , Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Lynn Waterman , Beth Willis , "Celia G. Snyder" , Bill Oliver , Jim Powell , Tim Stowell , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , MS Piglet Subject: How I see the project Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: d8f118d857c2e41653997dfc4a3beaca I have been involved as a transcriber and Census Project coordinator for TX, AL an MS. I am becoming quite disappointed with the manner in which this file issue is being handled. I do not want to contribute to the traffic on the list about this but I will do so after I complete this e-mail. I want to say that I support the USGenWeb projects in their entirety. This includes the tombstone, census and any other projects developed under this program. This bickering and attacking Kay Mason about where the files are stored is ridiculous. 1. What difference does it make where the census transcription files are stored as long as they remain on RootsWeb. 2. What difference does it make where the census transcription files are stored on RootsWeb as long as they remain accessible free of charge to all researchers. 3. What difference does it make where the census transcription files are stored on RootsWeb as long as county coordinators can link or download them to their own pages. 4. Why do the files need to be downloaded to the individual county pages taking up double the space when they can link to and storage location on RootsWeb. My main question is WHY when someone is improving a system do the others in this program, on the board and otherwise, find it necessary to attack. This should not be a power struggle. My sign-up pages had not been updated since August 1998. I now update my own pages, send them weekly to Sue Soden for proofing, she uploads the pages for me and my pages are now staying current. Sue also uploads any time I send in one during the week if I, as the coordinator, believe that an error exist that needs immediate correction. Kay has been tireless in her assistance to me. I took over one state at a time until I felt that I had it under control. She did the work on all the others until such time as I asked her to release them to me. When I lost my husband in Dec 1997, if I had been Kay, I would have fired me . She encouraged me, never failed to ask if I needed her to assist me and always helped me when I needed her to handle something I could not emotionally handle at that time. Why now is she being attacked the way I am seeing her attacked on these list. I see where people are saying they thought they were volunteering for the Census Archives or some such thing. I thought we were all volunteering for the Promotion of free census on-line for all researchers. What difference does it make what the file directory is called? I feel that it is the responsibility of the Board to resolve these issues. Has anyone of you thought what the loss to this project would be if Kay Mason, Sue Soden, Trey Holt, Phil Basher or many, many of the other dedicated volunteers said: "I have had enough. I don't want to deal with the petty, spiteful attitudes anymore." I am asking each and everyone of you to support the Census Project in such a manner that allows the improvements continue, to come out on the list in support of Kay's efforts, and to immediately stop the bickering that does nothing constructive for you or for the others of us who volunteer. When we get new volunteers, how must we look to them? I have been around volunteer organizations a lot of years and have seen this type thing tear the entire organization apart. Please put your own egos aside and look at how far we have come. Look at how much better it is to have the pages updated on a regular basis instead of having to wait 5 or 6 months. I want to add here that Holly Trimm did a very good job but 50 states and lord only knows how many counties is too much for one person. Please consider that the volunteers put in many hours, I am including the board here, and those hours should be joyful not filled with this spite that I have recently seen. My two cents worth. Veda Mendoza -- Veda Mendoza USGenWeb Census Project Coordinator for Alabama, Mississippi & Texas Census Look Ups: http://www.rootsweb.com/~uslookup/ Personal Genealogy: http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Flats/7203 ------=_NextPart_000_00A3_01BF7D2D.832C92C0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="How much is enough.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="How much is enough.eml" Return-Path: Received: from dexter.ionia-mi.net (root@dexter.ionia-mi.net [207.142.187.7]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA15618 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 21:48:07 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (max1-l45.ionia-mi.net [207.142.187.128]) by dexter.ionia-mi.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id WAA20764; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 22:46:25 -0500 (EST) From: "Beth Wills" To: "Yvonne James-Henderson" , "Trey Holt" , "Tim Stowell" , "Megan Zurawicz" , "Lynn Watermann" , "Kim Harris Myers" , "Jim Powell" , "Ginger Cisewski" , "Celia Snyder" , "Bridgett" , "Bonnie McVicar Briggs" , "Bill Oliver" , "Betsy" , "Kay Mason" , "Jan Craven" Subject: How much is enough Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 22:49:26 -0500 Message-ID: <01be5a28$83bc4ce0$35bb8ecf@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 X-UIDL: 746cc1c4de7d3db9c5de5b59f181dec6 Okay ! For those of you who have indicated that I PROMISED to stick this out through thick and thin.....We have got to get things on track. I am going nuts here trying to figure out what is going on, who's on first, etc. And, I think that I have walked on egg shells long enough. There is currently a motion on Board-L that has been seconded. Any board member can call a motion and call for a vote. Now lets get down to business and vote so that we can get the rest of this mess cleaned up. Beth P.S. I don't know how many places my name and addy are still showing as acting NC, but I am going to start forwarding all of the stuff that I am getting to all of you - kind of a share and share alike thing :-) ------=_NextPart_000_00A3_01BF7D2D.832C92C0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="I havent made the motion yet.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="I havent made the motion yet.eml" Return-Path: Received: from portal.txcyber.com (root@portal.cy-net.net [205.140.147.1]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA05017 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 19:09:35 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (ppp222.cy-net.net [208.21.195.31]) by portal.txcyber.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id TAA10395; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 19:23:44 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19990216190850.0197c3a0@txcyber.com> X-Sender: holt@txcyber.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 19:08:50 -0600 To: "Beth Wills" , "Ms. Piglet" , "Yvonne James-Henderson" , "Lynn Watermann" , "Kim Harris Myers" , "Kay Mason" , "Jim Powell" , "Jan Craven" , "Ginger Cisewski" , "Celia Snyder" , "Bridgett" , "Bill Oliver" , "Betsy" , "Bonnie McVicar Briggs" , From: Trey Holt Subject: I havent made the motion yet In-Reply-To: <01be5a10$6a985fa0$35bb8ecf@default> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: e2153f6cac3063b3ff1161f07d288594 Whoa!, I havent made the motion yet, only proposed. getting feedback but I am ready to move it to Board-L Trey At 07:56 PM 2/16/99 -0500, Beth Wills wrote: >A motion has been made and seconded. I call the motion - and call for a >vote. > >Beth Wills bwills@ionia-mi.net >NE/NCentral Region Advisory Board C C Rep >USGenWeb Project >Ionia County MIGenWeb Coordinator >http://www.rootsweb.com/~miionia >Gladwin County MIGenWeb Coordinator >http://www.rootsweb.com/~migladwi >Saginaw County MIGenWeb Coordinator >http://www.rootsweb.com/~misagina/Saginaw.html > >-----Original Message----- >From: Trey Holt >To: Ms. Piglet ; Yvonne James-Henderson >; Beth Wills ; Lynn Watermann >; Kim Harris Myers ; Kay Mason >; Jim Powell ; Jan Craven >; Ginger Cisewski ; Celia Snyder >; Bridgett ; Bill Oliver >; Betsy ; Bonnie McVicar >Briggs ; tstowell@mccallie.org > >Date: Tuesday, February 16, 1999 7:40 PM >Subject: Immediate Board Action Needed > > >>Fellow Board members (I am including Kay and Jan in this discussion), >> >>I am PREPARED to make the following motion to the Board-L list if everyone >>is in agreement. >> >>proposed motion: >> >>I move that the following statement be issued to as many mailing lists as >>possible. and that the first paragraph be immediatly posted to the USGenWeb >>Project web page concerning the special projects. >> >>"We "The USGenWeb Project Advisory Board" want to remind all persons >>involved with "The USGenWeb Project" that all original records that are >>transcribed and submitted to any special project whether it be "The >>USGenWeb Archives Project", "The USGenWeb Census Project", "The USGenWeb >>Tombstone Project" or any other special project are a part of The USGenWeb >>Project's "digital library" known as "The USGenWeb Project Archives". >>Patrons who submit data to "The USGenWeb Project Archives" through any of >>its special projects should feel confident and be aware that no matter what >>directory the data that they have submitted may reside, it is a part of >>"The USGenWeb Project Archives". Patrons should also be aware that the >>directory locations of any data submitted may change from time to time >>within "The USGenWeb Project Archives" for organizational purposes. >> >>The Board strongly recommends that the special project named in the bylaws >>as "The USGenWeb Archives Project" leave the job of transcribing original >>US Census records and recruiting volunteers for the same purpose to the >>special project named in the bylaws as "The USGenWeb Census Project" and >>that "The USGenWeb Archives Project" should otherwise direct their efforts >>to transcribing the other vast volumes of original records that need to be >>transcribed in this country. "The USGenWeb Census Project" should continue >>to notify the file managers of "The USGenWeb Archives Project" when new >>transcriptions are completed so that these files may be included with >>original scanned images or other county file structures as may have been >>established or deemed neccessary. It is further the recommendation of this >>board that at such time "The USGenWeb Census Project" completes its mission >>and all US Census original records are transcribed and uploaded to the >>"digital library" known as "The USGenWeb Project Archives" that an >>assessment should be done of "The USGenWeb Project Archives" and any >>duplicated files be combined." >>--------- >> >> >>In my opinion we need to expedite this tonight or ASAP and get this out. >>One the motion is made and seconded a board member may call the vote in >>which case the call and then the motion may be voted on. Things are being >>set up on the archives list and it looks like Linda and Joy may be planning >>to resign. No reasons were given but they are about to start conatcting >>everyone who has submitted census records to ask permission to post in the >>archives directory. The longer this goes on the more people are getting >>confused and now everyone that has submitted data is about to get confused >to. >> >>Lets please push this through ASAP. >>This is the last comments I will make on this subject until you guys are >>ready to proceed. I am very close however to start issuing my own >>statements here and there because I'm not ready to see this whole thing go >>down the tubes. >> >>Respectfully >>Trey >> > > > ------=_NextPart_000_00A3_01BF7D2D.832C92C0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Immediate Board Action Needed.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Immediate Board Action Needed.eml" Return-Path: Received: from portal.txcyber.com (root@portal.cy-net.net [205.140.147.1]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA27854 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 18:40:17 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (ppp222.cy-net.net [208.21.195.31]) by portal.txcyber.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id SAA06467; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 18:54:36 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19990216183943.0087dec0@txcyber.com> X-Sender: holt@txcyber.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) X-Priority: 1 (Highest) Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 18:39:43 -0600 To: "Ms. Piglet" , "Yvonne James-Henderson" , "Beth Wills" , "Lynn Watermann" , "Kim Harris Myers" , "Kay Mason" , "Jim Powell" , "Jan Craven" , "Ginger Cisewski" , "Celia Snyder" , "Bridgett" , "Bill Oliver" , "Betsy" , "Bonnie McVicar Briggs" , From: Trey Holt Subject: Immediate Board Action Needed In-Reply-To: <055201be5943$89ef6100$180a9cd1@william> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: 19e410ed6dffaf47b03800596b2f0dba Fellow Board members (I am including Kay and Jan in this discussion), I am PREPARED to make the following motion to the Board-L list if everyone is in agreement. proposed motion: I move that the following statement be issued to as many mailing lists as possible. and that the first paragraph be immediatly posted to the USGenWeb Project web page concerning the special projects. "We "The USGenWeb Project Advisory Board" want to remind all persons involved with "The USGenWeb Project" that all original records that are transcribed and submitted to any special project whether it be "The USGenWeb Archives Project", "The USGenWeb Census Project", "The USGenWeb Tombstone Project" or any other special project are a part of The USGenWeb Project's "digital library" known as "The USGenWeb Project Archives". Patrons who submit data to "The USGenWeb Project Archives" through any of its special projects should feel confident and be aware that no matter what directory the data that they have submitted may reside, it is a part of "The USGenWeb Project Archives". Patrons should also be aware that the directory locations of any data submitted may change from time to time within "The USGenWeb Project Archives" for organizational purposes. The Board strongly recommends that the special project named in the bylaws as "The USGenWeb Archives Project" leave the job of transcribing original US Census records and recruiting volunteers for the same purpose to the special project named in the bylaws as "The USGenWeb Census Project" and that "The USGenWeb Archives Project" should otherwise direct their efforts to transcribing the other vast volumes of original records that need to be transcribed in this country. "The USGenWeb Census Project" should continue to notify the file managers of "The USGenWeb Archives Project" when new transcriptions are completed so that these files may be included with original scanned images or other county file structures as may have been established or deemed neccessary. It is further the recommendation of this board that at such time "The USGenWeb Census Project" completes its mission and all US Census original records are transcribed and uploaded to the "digital library" known as "The USGenWeb Project Archives" that an assessment should be done of "The USGenWeb Project Archives" and any duplicated files be combined." --------- In my opinion we need to expedite this tonight or ASAP and get this out. One the motion is made and seconded a board member may call the vote in which case the call and then the motion may be voted on. Things are being set up on the archives list and it looks like Linda and Joy may be planning to resign. No reasons were given but they are about to start conatcting everyone who has submitted census records to ask permission to post in the archives directory. The longer this goes on the more people are getting confused and now everyone that has submitted data is about to get confused to. Lets please push this through ASAP. This is the last comments I will make on this subject until you guys are ready to proceed. I am very close however to start issuing my own statements here and there because I'm not ready to see this whole thing go down the tubes. Respectfully Trey ------=_NextPart_000_00A3_01BF7D2D.832C92C0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="In Response to Jim.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="In Response to Jim.eml" Return-Path: Received: from usunwired.net (mailserver.usunwired.net [208.215.35.11]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id OAA08947 [xxxxxx] Sat, 27 Feb 1999 14:05:44 -0600 (CST) Received: from jcraven.iamerica.net [208.241.128.248] by usunwired.net (SMTPD32-4.07) id AFE1398C00B2; Sat, 27 Feb 1999 14:04:49 CDT Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19990227140651.0089c5a0@mail.usunwired.net> X-Sender: jcraven@mail.usunwired.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 14:06:51 -0700 To: jpowelljr From: Jan Craven Subject: In Response to Jim Cc: MSPIGLET@prodigy.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, hen1@IDT.NET, FEATHER2s@aol.com, jcraven@usunwired.net, bascs@wizard.com, estral@switchboard.net, holt@txcyber.com, bwills@ionia-mi.net, betsym@1starnet.com, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, wnoliver@glasscity.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com, cestus3@inetnebr.com In-Reply-To: <36D8011C.76389A05@worldnet.att.net> References: <199902261949.LAA08982@jubjub.wizard.com> <36D70593.5CF9@ix.netcom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: fb3c71dc0f00dd9f53c1f5810b238150 Jim, This is not addressed to me but I'll try to answer the quesstions you presented about the archvies. At 09:28 AM 2/27/1999 -0500, you wrote: >Linda and Kay... At this point I respect both of you for >what you have done for online Genealogy and what you can do >in the future. I hope that the two of you can find common >ground here. The only real concern that Linda can come up >with is the fact that the Census Project does not directly >place transcriptions in the "proper" directory. (I do detect >a "sour grapes" complex pushing this issue). Would it be a >problem to state on the Census Project Pages that "All >transcriptions will be stored as part of the Census Project >and a copy will be sent to the Archives to be included in >the Project's Digital Library" >Now for all of the above to have any meaning at all the >Archives must reaffirm their support of USGenWeb and their >intention to remain a part of USGenWeb as long as USGenWeb >exists as Project promoting Free Online Genealogical >Resources. I don't think that is a problem at all. I think Linda's statement meant that it was unlikely that we were going anywhere. It would take something really drastic to get the majority ofl 50+ AC's to vote to disconnect the archives from the usgw proj. I really have not heard anyone even discuss the possibility, much less doing it! We're not going anywhere. >Please be careful Linda, I have sent a lot of data to the >Archives with the understanding that the Archives were an >integral part of USGenWeb. If that was a misunderstanding >based on information from representatives of the Archives, I >just might want my data back, and USGenWeb just might have >need of their own Digital Library. That is not the case. >After a moment of reflection, I guess what is bothering me >about Linda's words of late is how directly they oppose what >submitters are told. I was told all about how the USGenWeb >Archives was set up as part of USGenWeb and was a forever >type thing, when I resisted send in items at first. When I >volunteered to upload the Henderson County, KY Archives, I >was told that it was all part of the same thing and it was >tied to my county there. I was told there were 3 >directories for Henderson County, the HTML directory where >my pages are stored, the ftp directory where the >transcriptions are stored and the TOC, directory where the >table of contents resided. Now it seems like I'm being told >that the Archives have only been along for the ride and at >any time they may leave. What would the majority of the >submitters think about that? What you as a submitter was told is FACT. Every one of us Archives Coordinators solicit files FOR the USGW Archives. It is part of our name and I cannot see that ever changing unless USGW kicks US out. It would be a nightmare to go back to all of the submitters if that ever happened. We'd have to get permission all over again. I am certainly not in favor of that! Do you know how many folks that is????? Not a job I'd want. I guess what I am saying is that, as the representative of the archvies, we are committed to being a part of usgw....as a group. On occasion there is a state that pulls out, but we go back and rebuild, don't we Betsy? I did not say any of this to be confrontational, so PLEASE don't take it that way! Jan ------=_NextPart_000_00A3_01BF7D2D.832C92C0-- [xxxxxxx] Tue Feb 22 13:09:50 2000 [xxxxxxx] Received: from mail1.radix.net (mail1.radix.net [207.192.128.31]) by saltmine.radix.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA13439 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:09:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from [xxxxxx] ([xxxxxx] [199.184.119.1]) by mail1.radix.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA19117 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:09:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (nei-pm2-018.inetnebr.com [206.222.223.92]) by [xxxxxx] (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA10382; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:09:41 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00b101bf7d5f$e8d98d80$5cdfdece@default> [xxxxxxx] To: "merope" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:08:56 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00AE_01BF7D2D.9E3F1D80" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00AE_01BF7D2D.9E3F1D80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------=_NextPart_000_00AE_01BF7D2D.9E3F1D80 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Letter to SC's.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Letter to SC's.eml" Return-Path: Received: from laf.cioe.com (laf.cioe.com [204.120.165.33]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA26980 [xxxxxx] Sun, 21 Feb 1999 22:42:00 -0600 (CST) Received: from gizmo (pool2-04.laf.cioe.com [204.248.217.67]) by laf.cioe.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA88591; Sun, 21 Feb 1999 23:41:57 -0500 (EST) From: "Roger Swafford" To: "Lynn Waterman" , "Amber Cory" , "Mary Ann Hetrick" , "Teresa Davis" Subject: Letter to SC's Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 23:35:41 -0500 Message-ID: <01be5e1c$cd6fbd20$LocalHost@gizmo> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 X-UIDL: 3ea0f2cfec5e2b415a3c3404682f78ec Dear State Coordinators, We need your help and cooperation in giving this letter the widest possible distribution throughout The USGenWeb Project. We wish to inform our fellow volunteers that a group of CC's have formed a committee to review the current bylaws. Our goal is to ensure that every volunteer working within the USGenWeb Project has the opportunity to submit feedback to our committee regarding their concerns related to the bylaws. Please see our website at http://wcic.cioe.com/~gizmo The goal of the committee is to present these proposed amendments for the annual USGenWeb general election in June, 1999. Several County Coordinators and State Coordinators have eloquently stated the need for amendments to our bylaws. We intend to present options for amendments during the coming months in order to draft proposed amendments with the greatest possible input from the general membership. A state sponsor for our proposals will be requested so this committee may work within the current bylaws. We also intend to remain as apolitical as possible. The contribution of each CC in this process is vital to maintain fairness and impartiality. Your assistance in sharing this information with your CC's is greatly appreciated. We welcome your response and input in the revision process. Thank you for your cooperation in this endeavor which affects the entire USGW project. Sincerely, Roger Swafford CCBRC, Chair Norma Lewis CCBRC,Vice-Chair ------=_NextPart_000_00AE_01BF7D2D.9E3F1D80 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Linda's message to SEMA mailing list (census).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Linda's message to SEMA mailing list (census).eml" Return-Path: Received: from jubjub.wizard.com (jubjub.wizard.com [199.171.28.9]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA23953 [xxxxxx] Fri, 26 Feb 1999 11:34:09 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (pm2-1-083.wizard.com [208.211.48.83]) by jubjub.wizard.com (8.9.2/8.9.0) with SMTP id JAA25264; Fri, 26 Feb 1999 09:33:43 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199902261733.JAA25264@jubjub.wizard.com> From: "Bridgett Smith" To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 09:33:24 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Linda's message to SE/MA mailing list (census) Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) X-UIDL: 71d94bbc7e5cfd88ce8524af4a0b1e36 <<<>>>> > > Only data submitted to the USGenWeb Archives and uploaded to the > USGenWeb Archives directory is "part of" the USGenWeb Archives. The home > directories of the Archives are: > > http://www.rootsweb.com/~usgenweb/xx (two letter state abbr) > for webpages such as the tables of contents, and graphics, such as the > census microfilm images > > and > > ftp://ftp.rootsweb.com/pub/usgenweb > for the text files which are indexed by the search engine > > A file submitted, for instance to a county coordinator only, for > uploading to their site, is not part of the USGenWeb Archives. Files > residing on other servers or even on Rootsweb, but not in the above > directories, are not part of the USGenWeb Archives. > > When a file is received, the archivists/file managers make a commitment > to the submitter that the file will be stored permanently in the > USGenWeb Archives for the benefit of researchers, and that the data will > not be sold nor will any fees be charged to access the files. The > Archives volunteers cannot be responsible for files located elsewhere. > > Thanks, > > Linda Everyone interprets messages different than others, as we all know. Some folks will even say that their interpretations of an email was the correct one without finding out for sure what the poster actually meant by the post. At this time I will let you all know that Linda's message bothered me when I read it on the SE/MA mailing list, it bothered me when I read it when Kay sent in a copy to us, and it still bothers me after reading it a 3rd time. Each time I read the message I got the feeling that Linda was snubbing her nose at the Board's Official statement regarding the Census Project issue. If this is not the case, could you folks please tell me why you don't think so? May be I need to get other's input on her statement -- I am flexible, my opinions can be changed, and don't want to cause problems -- but this is really bugging me. Thanks, Bridgett Bridgett Smith SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region bascs@wizard.com *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* TNGenWeb State Coordinator http://www.tngenweb.org/ ------=_NextPart_000_00AE_01BF7D2D.9E3F1D80 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Logo use.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Logo use.eml" Return-Path: Received: from truth.mccallie.org (mail.mccallie.org [209.140.58.34]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id MAA18696 [xxxxxx] Mon, 15 Feb 1999 12:51:09 -0600 (CST) Received: from tstowell.mccallie.org [10.151.1.85] by truth.mccallie.org (SMTPD32-4.06) id AC7C2A330174; Mon, 15 Feb 1999 13:50:36 EDT Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990215134702.008291c0@mail.mccallie.org> X-Sender: tstowell@mail.mccallie.org X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 13:47:02 -0500 To: "Yvonne James-Henderson" , "Trey Holt" , "Beth Wills" , "Megan Zurawicz" , "Lynn Watermann" , "Kim Harris Myers" , "Kay Mason" , "Jim Powell" , "Jan Craven" , "Ginger Cisewski" , "Celia Snyder" , "Bridgett" , "Bill Oliver" , "Betsy" , "Bonnie McVicar Briggs" From: "Christina Hunt" (by way of Tim Stowell ) Subject: Logo use Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: 4780dc5fdf57c179c1f04ffaedb4d368 I am writing to your regarding permission to use the Genweb logo on our library's Genealogy Links page. I am using the "I Love Genweb" logo, but I do think your official logo would be more representative. You can check out our page at: http://www.plcmc.lib.nc.us/online/nlinks/default.htm Regards, Christina --------------- Does anyone have a problem with her using our logo? I'd like to ask her to change the reference from GenWeb to USGenWeb Project though. ------=_NextPart_000_00AE_01BF7D2D.9E3F1D80 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Motion and Discussion Question.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Motion and Discussion Question.eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc05.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc05.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.40]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA13367 [xxxxxx] Sat, 13 Feb 1999 07:12:06 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.67.148.254]) by mtiwmhc05.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990213131135.EOKL2496@worldnet.att.net>; Sat, 13 Feb 1999 13:11:35 +0000 Message-ID: <36C57901.D3C07C75@worldnet.att.net> Date: Sat, 13 Feb 1999 08:07:14 -0500 From: William N Oliver Reply-To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net Organization: NEGenWeb/OHGenWeb/USGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,nl,de-CH,de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Ms. Piglet" , Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Kay Mason , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Lynn Watermann Subject: Motion and Discussion Question References: <109501be556a$fd096be0$680a9cd1@william> <36C56CF0.553F301A@worldnet.att.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: ffeddab93e7045dc61201e853f0951d9 Supposing that the Board decides to elect/appoint a secretary, would the secretary be responsible to also make mention and short summary of such posts that we all received from a Census Project member?? Bill -- ------=_NextPart_000_00AE_01BF7D2D.9E3F1D80 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Motions on the floorvotes.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Motions on the floorvotes.eml" Return-Path: Received: from jubjub.wizard.com (jubjub.wizard.com [199.171.28.9]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA10258 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 13:32:23 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (pm3-5-030.wizard.com [208.211.53.30]) by jubjub.wizard.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id LAA09065; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 11:39:32 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199902161939.LAA09065@jubjub.wizard.com> From: "Bridgett Smith" To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 11:31:44 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Motions on the floor/votes Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) X-UIDL: bc0a3654b1f222b39a0739d4c7d2403a Hi folks, There are, I think 3, motions on the floor? One is being voted on (with no time limit apparently), we need to clear these out as soon as possible don't you think? Tim had asked about the #ing of motions, if that was started by Nancy and continued on with the other temp NC's and the answer is yes to both questions. In #ing the motions, it is a way of discussing several items at one time w/o getting confused as long as the correct motion # is in the subject line. Tim, I know you are new to the way we have done business in the past and also know that you have your own ideas in how you would like to procede with things, so please don't take this wrong. Through trial and error, we have found that placing a time limit on voting on a motion is mandatory -- if not, then it seems to go on and on and on, until a majority has voted (9). If 9 of us haven't voted in the time period then a quorum is not reached and the motion dies. We have found that other things crop up with the board (like the census deal) and everything else goes out the window and some folks may forget to vote. Just thought I would pass this information on. Although I really think we need to get those 3 motions taken care of. Bridgett Bridgett Smith SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region bascs@wizard.com *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* TNGenWeb State Coordinator http://www.tngenweb.org/ ------=_NextPart_000_00AE_01BF7D2D.9E3F1D80 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="New Project-Old Problems.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="New Project-Old Problems.eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.airmail.net (mail.airmail.net [206.66.12.40]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id VAA19125 [xxxxxx] Mon, 15 Feb 1999 21:02:48 -0600 (CST) Received: from airmail.net from [207.136.38.154] by mail.airmail.net (/\##/\ Smail3.1.30.16 #30.388) with esmtp for [xxxxxxx] sender: id ; Mon, 15 Feb 99 21:02:28 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <36C8E015.F78D398@airmail.net> Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 21:03:49 -0600 From: Larry Cooley X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hen1@idt.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, bascs@snark.wizard.com, FEATHER2s@aol.com, estral@switchboard.net, holt@txcyber.com, cestus3@inetnebr.com, bwills@ionia-mi.net, betsym@1starnet.com, kmfkm@ptw.com, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, wnoliver@glasscity.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, MSPIGLET@prodigy.net, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net Subject: New Project-Old Problems Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 8ff3ef5cc304ed9828f93f1a75304524 Hello folks - I have an item that is of utmost importance to me. In 1998 I discovered the USGenWeb Census Project and volunteered to transcribe a county - naturally, it was to find some information about my ancestors. Since then, I have transcribed several others and have even proofread a few. It has been an enjoyable learning process, especially to see how many other people like myself are involved in such a project. In August, 1998, Kay Mason asked if I cared to volunteer to be the 'proofreader coordinator', updating the web pages for the USGenWeb Census Project. Since I had recently acquired a few basic skills in writing HTML code (and since I sometimes find it hard to say 'no'), I readily volunteered. It is an enjoyable process and I look forward daily to see how many new people offer to volunteer. The USGenWeb Census Project seems to be a wonderful organization - people helping people, learning about ancestors and in general just seeing what was 'going on' , especially in the 1800s. Recently, however, I have seen a lot of frustration building within the USGenWeb Census Project - whatever the reason. I've only read the posts and decided that it would either go away or be resolved, or mediated, by other parties - in particular the board. It hasn't happened yet, but I know that it will be resolved. Until today, that's all I was - an interested party. I have found what is evidently a NEW PROJECT - The USGenWeb ARCHIVE Census Project. Let me ask a few questions, please: Is this a NEW project that duplicates the efforts of the USGenWeb Census Project? If so, WHY do we need 2 projects? I suspect that our by-laws call for only one project. And, why would an 'archive' need volunteers to transcribe or proofread? All a person has to do is review the e-mail posts to the Chats and see that many, many volunteers don't know where their transcriptions are going - or why. One of the e-mails I read (if I remember correctly) stated that there were over 900 volunteers for transcribing/proofreading. That is A MUCH LARGER NUMBER that I remember hearing about when I first volunteered to transcribe!! Surely the USGenWeb Census Project has prospered greatly. My next question / statement: Today (2/15/99) I found four (4) of the pages I created (for the USGenWeb Census Project) copied and located at the ARCHIVE CENSUS PROJECT. Each of the pages contains the normal copyright clause like most other USGenWeb Census Project web pages. And although my copyright clause had been left intact, the pages in fact were copied WITHOUT my permission or knowledge. Some minor changes had been made, such as alignment and the e-mail address to whom submissions would be sent if a person volunteered. These are the facts, and I will not condone copying of my work. I do not want to resign from the volunteer position I am in. I like working with Sue and Kay. The ASSIST staff is great and has helped me on a couple of occasions. Their work is great !! Now my requests: the ARCHIVE Census Project should remove my work from their web pages immediately. I would expect to receive a sincere apology for their copying of my work and a promise NOT to copy it again. If the ARCHIVE Census Project is duplicating the work of the USGenWeb Census Project, why would their actions be sanctioned? Or is all of their work a result of the bickering and frustration (of not getting one's way) that has gone (probably behind the scenes) for several months? Please, let's get this finished. You - the board - are evidently the only group to mediate this and resolve the problems. Please do. And remember - they are copying my work, which I will not permit. Thank you for your time. Larry Cooley Proofreader Coordinator, USGenWeb Census Project ------=_NextPart_000_00AE_01BF7D2D.9E3F1D80-- [xxxxxxx] Tue Feb 22 13:10:29 2000 [xxxxxxx] Received: from mail1.radix.net (mail1.radix.net [207.192.128.31]) by saltmine.radix.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA13490 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:10:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from [xxxxxx] ([xxxxxx] [199.184.119.1]) by mail1.radix.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA19202 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:10:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (nei-pm2-018.inetnebr.com [206.222.223.92]) by [xxxxxx] (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA10699; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:10:21 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00bc01bf7d60$00d11ca0$5cdfdece@default> [xxxxxxx] To: "merope" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:09:45 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00B9_01BF7D2D.B636ACA0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00B9_01BF7D2D.B636ACA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------=_NextPart_000_00B9_01BF7D2D.B636ACA0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="OHGenWeb SC resignation.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="OHGenWeb SC resignation.eml" Return-Path: Received: from s20.highertech.net (root@s20.highertech.net [209.54.120.20]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA26378 [xxxxxx] Sat, 27 Feb 1999 12:57:37 -0600 (CST) Received: from pizzard.chattanooga.net (tnt1-34.highertech.net [209.140.61.34]) by s20.highertech.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id NAA22587; Sat, 27 Feb 1999 13:54:56 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990227120706.007b7be0@mail.chattanooga.net> X-Sender: tstowell@mail.chattanooga.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 12:07:06 -0500 To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, bascs@snark.wizard.com, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com From: jkelble@accnorwalk.com (Judy Kelble) (by way of Tim Stowell ) Subject: OHGenWeb SC resignation Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: ed1c033764b8d2364928b595979a3e60 Hi All, I wanted to contact you, my much loved volunteers, Tim Stowell, our National Coordinator and Kim Harris Meyers, our regional State Coord Rep before announcing this to the OHGenWeb folks in general. I have been thinking about this for several months and am now comfortable with the idea that I have resurrected OHGenWeb to a pretty decent state of affairs. I have accomplished a lot of good for Ohio and smoothed a lot of ruffled feathers, but there is a lot yet to be done. I have been in the saddle for a year and am developing saddle sores. I love my job. Is there really a genealogy world out there? I love my job! Is there really a world out there? I love my job. You get the idea. I long to be able to do some research of my own and devote more time to Huron and Lorain County web sites. I, hereby, announce my resignation as OHGenWeb State Coordinator, effective ASAP. I will, of course, remain on the job that I have grown to love/hate until a new SC is installed and comfortable with the duties. I hope this can be accomplished by the end of March 1999, if not before. I have asked Patty Lindsay, OHGenWeb ASC, to manage the election of a new State Coordinator for OHGenWeb, as she did a year ago. She has agreed to do so. Thanks, Patty. I want to thank all of my volunteers: Allen Richmond - ASC - general mentor and boot strap puller upper Patty Lindsay - ASC - CCH specialist and strong shoulder Maggie Stewart-Zimmerman - Archivist and good Buddy Willi Waltrip - All inclusive Ohio place names - my own personal Defunctus! Bernice - Family Reunions - what a great job and how it has grown! Mark Roberts - all those queries for unknown places in Ohio - who never knew there were so many lost souls! I want to thank each and every one of you for all your support along the way. You are each very special to me in your own way and I hope to never loose touch. I will be making a formal announcement to the OHGenWeb mail list on Monday March 1, 1999. Peace, Judy Kelble OHGenWeb State Coordinator http://www.rootsweb.com/~ohgenweb President Huron County Chapter/OGS http://www.rootsweb.com/~ohhuron Listowner Huron County, Ohio Lorain County, Ohio ------=_NextPart_000_00B9_01BF7D2D.B636ACA0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Open Message.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Open Message.eml" Return-Path: Received: from smtp.email.msn.com ([207.46.181.19]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA18856 [xxxxxx] Sat, 13 Feb 1999 08:02:15 -0600 (CST) Received: from ellen - 153.37.193.50 by email.msn.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 13 Feb 1999 06:01:46 -0800 Message-ID: <002e01be5759$5ffd6360$32c12599@ellen> From: "Chas & Ellen Horner" To: [xxxxxxx] Subject: Open Message Date: Sat, 13 Feb 1999 08:01:37 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-UIDL: 81c542d07262edebab255f839a32a33e Your first message was returned by Postmaster because I had a typo in your addy. Ellen An Open Message to All Advisory Board Members In1997 I volunteered for the Census Project. Kay Mason signed me up and I began my transcribing of TX Brazos 1850. This transcription was u/l in early December 1997. Three additional TX counties have been transcribed and submitted by me. Several months elapsed before these were u/l. As a new transcriber, I wondered why it took so long for an u/l. Kay took me up on my volunteering for additional 'jobs'. She asked me to keep a spreadsheet of u/l census transcriptions. Together we decided on the format and what 'stats' to record on the spreadsheet. Revisions included adding and/or deleting items. In the beginning, Kay would send me the information. Since December 1998, Sue has sent me a weekly report of u/ls. One of the items on the Master Census Transcription Inventory relates to online status, i.e. (1) when & how is the transcription 'buttoned', (2) is the transcription accessible to researchers (this directly relates to (1) ). Each week I make a comparison of the online status and the Master Inventory. I advised Kay of discrepancies so that she could notify Holly. Sometimes the correct button was applied, but more often than not they weren't. This meant that the general public had no access to the online transcriptions. Last week, for the first time ever since I began the Master Census Inventory, buttons are correctly applied and u/l transcriptions are available to the world. What a giant step forward. We can thank Sue Soden for this update. As well as transcribing and keeping the Master Census Transcription Inventory, I volunteered to learn how to format and u/l completed/submitted transcriptions. Now that has been an experience. I've learned that transcribers are wonderful people, but for some reason some of them either can't or won't follow directions for transcribing and some don't know how to spell. (Can you imagine volunteering for the census project and spelling census - 'cencus'? I don't think it was a typo.) Some transcriptions can be formatted and u/l in a short time. Others take hours and hours of correcting. That's o.k. We're working together to meet our goal of getting census records online. Kay has organized a group of volunteers who believe in helping each other - we all believe in a team approach. For the very first time, I can see the results of a logical and organized approach to this infant project. We really have a fantastic Census Project which is growing daily with online transcriptions. Ellen Horner File Manager USGenWeb Census Project chas_horn@email.msn.com ------=_NextPart_000_00B9_01BF7D2D.B636ACA0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Organization.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Organization.eml" Return-Path: Received: from jubjub.wizard.com (jubjub.wizard.com [199.171.28.9]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA06216 [xxxxxx] Fri, 26 Feb 1999 14:16:08 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (pm2-1-083.wizard.com [208.211.48.83]) by jubjub.wizard.com (8.9.2/8.9.0) with SMTP id MAA12344; Fri, 26 Feb 1999 12:15:50 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199902262015.MAA12344@jubjub.wizard.com> From: "Bridgett Smith" To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 12:15:30 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Organization Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) X-UIDL: a5d42d7066d31d8a9d7b13c1ee32c2f9 It occurred to me while I was typing up my last tome (sorry about that folks) that the project is really very disorganized in the way it is set up. I also know that a lot of this disorganization is the result of ideas that came up as an afterthought, and understandable why it has gotten disorganized. I strongly feel that any of the national projects need to be with one domain name. This is more for our own protection than anything else. I am NOT saying that RW is going anywhere anytime soon, but I would rather see all of the national project areas under the usgenweb.org/net/com domain. What if -- down the road in 5 or 10 years that RW folds for some reason (very hypothetical, but not impossible), or RW and USGW came to a parting of the ways. It would be much less disturbing to the internet community if the domain changes ISP's (so to speak), instead of all the URL's going bad all at once. I have heard this mentioned before, and the argument being what about all the files already uploaded under the RW domain name? That would be a chore to change those files. Well, yes it would, but 5 or 10 years down the road would be much worse don't you think? I am not a computer nerd, by any means, but I believe a script could be developed in Unix language that could go in and change all references to www.rootsweb.com on our national sites over to www.usgenweb.org/com/net Am I way off base in this thinking? Comments appreciated. Bridgett Bridgett Smith SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region bascs@wizard.com *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* TNGenWeb State Coordinator http://www.tngenweb.org/ ------=_NextPart_000_00B9_01BF7D2D.B636ACA0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Preview to the Bd list.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Preview to the Bd list.eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.39]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA04173 [xxxxxx] Sat, 20 Feb 1999 18:15:50 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.67.128.39]) by mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990221001519.BJCU29836@worldnet.att.net>; Sun, 21 Feb 1999 00:15:19 +0000 Message-ID: <36CF4FD1.79789DBE@worldnet.att.net> Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 19:14:10 -0500 From: William N Oliver Reply-To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net Organization: NEGenWeb/OHGenWeb/USGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,nl,de-CH,de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Waterman, Lynn" , "Mason, Kay" , "Cisewski, Ginger" Subject: Preview to the Bd list Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: f4c1f59d1a5e9ad50aaa24ffd293965d Good Evening Good Folks, If you have not read the DBS for today [and I really am opening myself here to admitting that I occasionally visit and that is not something I really wish to let her know] it has a most interesting report among the others. How does Teresa know that there is a grievance against Linda and that Linda is "scrambling" around to get a counter grievance filed?? How is she able to quote messages that are supposedly only going to the Board?? The grievance was not known outside this Board and the person filing it. Is someone on this Board wanting to side derail the Board again??? I sure can't see the advantage of closing Board-L, board business is apparently being leaked for purposes unknown and for private agendas. Bill -- ------=_NextPart_000_00B9_01BF7D2D.B636ACA0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re [ARCHIVES-L] Re [USGenWeb-SE-L] [BOARD-L] Census Statement.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re [ARCHIVES-L] Re [USGenWeb-SE-L] [BOARD-L] Census Statement.eml" Return-Path: Received: from dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.10]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA13768 [xxxxxx] Fri, 26 Feb 1999 00:57:07 -0600 (CST) Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id AAA14377; Fri, 26 Feb 1999 00:54:05 -0600 (CST) Received: from irv-ca50-02.ix.netcom.com(207.94.86.2) by dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma014229; Fri Feb 26 00:53:31 1999 Message-ID: <36D6442B.67A9@ix.netcom.com> Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 22:50:19 -0800 From: Linda Lewis Organization: USGenWeb Archives, VAGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-NC320 (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Tim Stowell CC: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, jpowelljr , Bridgett Smith , bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, betsym@1starnet.com, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net Subject: Re: [ARCHIVES-L] Re: [USGenWeb-SE-L] [BOARD-L] Census Statement References: <3.0.5.32.19990222003241.0081db40@mail.mccallie.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: b105da33026042ecfaf2cb614c27a5a9 So that all can see the message. This was sent to the USGenWeb-SE-L list, and cc'd to ARCHIVES-L. As I've said before.. we don't hide anything. If anyone wants to see any message posted to the Archives mailing list... I'll gladly forward it, or they can go to the mailing lists search page. > jpowelljr wrote: > [me, responding to Jim's posting of the the motion to the SE list] > I need to comment one part of the recent motion: > > > > > Patrons who submit data to "The > > USGenWeb Project Archives" through any of its special > > projects should feel confident and be aware that no matter > > what > > directory the data that they have submitted may reside, it > > is and shall remain a part of "The USGenWeb Project > > Archives". Patrons should also be aware that the directory > > locations of any data submitted may change from time to time > > within "The USGenWeb Project Archives" for organizational > > purposes. > > > > Only data submitted to the USGenWeb Archives and uploaded to the > USGenWeb Archives directory is "part of" the USGenWeb Archives. The home > directories of the Archives are: > > http://www.rootsweb.com/~usgenweb/xx (two letter state abbr) > for webpages such as the tables of contents, and graphics, such as the > census microfilm images > > and > > ftp://ftp.rootsweb.com/pub/usgenweb > for the text files which are indexed by the search engine > > A file submitted, for instance to a county coordinator only, for > uploading to their site, is not part of the USGenWeb Archives. Files > residing on other servers or even on Rootsweb, but not in the above > directories, are not part of the USGenWeb Archives. > > When a file is received, the archivists/file managers make a commitment > to the submitter that the file will be stored permanently in the > USGenWeb Archives for the benefit of researchers, and that the data will > not be sold nor will any fees be charged to access the files. The > Archives volunteers cannot be responsible for files located elsewhere. > > Thanks, > > Linda ------=_NextPart_000_00B9_01BF7D2D.B636ACA0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re [BOARD-L] Amendment to Motion 99-2.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re [BOARD-L] Amendment to Motion 99-2.eml" Return-Path: Received: from bl-14.rootsweb.com (bl-14.rootsweb.com [204.212.38.30]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA01173 [xxxxxx] Thu, 18 Feb 1999 14:13:31 -0600 (CST) Received: (from slist@localhost) by bl-14.rootsweb.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA29520; Thu, 18 Feb 1999 12:00:23 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 12:00:23 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <36CC7402.F804CC19@worldnet.att.net> Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 15:11:47 -0500 From: William N Oliver Reply-To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net Organization: NEGenWeb/OHGenWeb/USGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,nl,de-CH,de MIME-Version: 1.0 Old-To: BOARD-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [BOARD-L] Amendment to Motion 99-2 References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"N2Ds_.A.QMH.VFHz2"@bl-14.rootsweb.com> To: BOARD-L@rootsweb.com Resent-From: BOARD-L@rootsweb.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/1590 X-Loop: BOARD-L@rootsweb.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: BOARD-L-request@rootsweb.com X-UIDL: a7f78c08433f252a7af79ccd56ba1437 The amendment to Motion 99-2 looks OK to me, and since it is amended by the original mover, I'll second the amendment. Thus, it should be open for discussion. Bill -- FEATHER2s@aol.com wrote: > Motion 99-2 as originally made is unintentionally vague and I wish to amend it > for specificity as follows: > > I MOVE that the motion to appoint a secretary which was tabled in the Oct. 4, > 1998 meeting be reopened and a secretary be elected by the Advisory board from > among the membership of said Board, with the duties and responsibilities of > the Secretary to be as follows: > > 1. To post Board minutes > 2. To number all motions > 3. To declare the status of motions including quorum of votes and the point > at which > enough votes have been posted to decide the motion, plus the final talley > of votes > 4. To post Board announcements to all Regional Lists > 5. To maintain the Advisory Board Passwords as a backup in order to pass them > on > to the next authorized National Coordinator, whether interim or elected > > Ginger Cisewski > NW-Plains CC-Rep ------=_NextPart_000_00B9_01BF7D2D.B636ACA0-- [xxxxxxx] Tue Feb 22 13:19:33 2000 [xxxxxxx] Received: from mail1.radix.net (mail1.radix.net [207.192.128.31]) by saltmine.radix.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA14495 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:19:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from [xxxxxx] ([xxxxxx] [199.184.119.1]) by mail1.radix.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA20927 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:19:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (nei-pm2-018.inetnebr.com [206.222.223.92]) by [xxxxxx] (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA15278; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:19:27 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <014001bf7d61$461a6d60$5cdfdece@default> [xxxxxxx] To: "merope" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:18:51 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_013D_01BF7D2E.FB7FFD60" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_013D_01BF7D2E.FB7FFD60 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------=_NextPart_000_013D_01BF7D2E.FB7FFD60 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re [BOARD-L] Vote on Motion 99-2.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re [BOARD-L] Vote on Motion 99-2.eml" Return-Path: Received: from bl-14.rootsweb.com (bl-14.rootsweb.com [204.212.38.30]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA27116 [xxxxxx] Sat, 20 Feb 1999 17:35:40 -0600 (CST) Received: (from slist@localhost) by bl-14.rootsweb.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA16539; Sat, 20 Feb 1999 15:22:23 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 15:22:23 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <36CF45F9.6A1B@ix.netcom.com> Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 15:32:10 -0800 From: Linda Russell Lewis Organization: USGenWeb Archives, VAGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-NC320 (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 Old-To: board-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [BOARD-L] Vote on Motion 99-2 References: <36CF44A0.74ABFE77@worldnet.att.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"VXhlyC.A.sBE.uO0z2"@bl-14.rootsweb.com> To: BOARD-L@rootsweb.com Resent-From: BOARD-L@rootsweb.com Reply-To: BOARD-L@rootsweb.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/1601 X-Loop: BOARD-L@rootsweb.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: BOARD-L-request@rootsweb.com X-UIDL: 145d1a723fe10b22b85f15a32900b1ca On motion 99-2: Aye on the Call to the Question Aye on the Substitute Motion Linda ------=_NextPart_000_013D_01BF7D2E.FB7FFD60 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re [BOARD-L] Welcome!.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re [BOARD-L] Welcome!.eml" Return-Path: Received: from bl-14.rootsweb.com (bl-14.rootsweb.com [204.212.38.30]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA02181 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 20:58:39 -0600 (CST) Received: (from slist@localhost) by bl-14.rootsweb.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA04307; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 18:45:47 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 18:45:47 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <36CA2FFE.D83B04C6@worldnet.att.net> Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 21:57:03 -0500 From: William N Oliver Reply-To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net Organization: NEGenWeb/OHGenWeb/USGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,nl,de-CH,de MIME-Version: 1.0 Old-To: BOARD-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [BOARD-L] Welcome! References: <3.0.3.32.19990213214844.006b5a08@mail.tds.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"lqJjC.A.CDB.a1iy2"@bl-14.rootsweb.com> To: BOARD-L@rootsweb.com Resent-From: BOARD-L@rootsweb.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/1561 X-Loop: BOARD-L@rootsweb.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: BOARD-L-request@rootsweb.com X-UIDL: 3dbac5f6ba607397bba6c1c338df6cb3 I second Trey's motion: Bill -- ------=_NextPart_000_013D_01BF7D2E.FB7FFD60 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re a couple of items you may wish to know.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re a couple of items you may wish to know.eml" Return-Path: Received: from virtualmaster3-int.prodigy.net (virtualmaster3-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.59.137]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA04385 [xxxxxx] Sat, 13 Feb 1999 17:09:05 -0600 (CST) Received: from william (CHCGB208-17.splitrock.net [209.156.13.40]) by virtualmaster3-int.prodigy.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA187546; Sat, 13 Feb 1999 18:08:36 -0500 Message-ID: <0b4901be57a5$25d52aa0$550d9cd1@william> From: "Ms. Piglet" To: "Beth Wills" , "Betsy" , "Bill Oliver" , "Bridgett" , "Celia Snyder" , "Ginger Cisewski" , "Jan Craven" , "Jim Powell" , "Kay Mason" , "Kim Harris Myers" , "Lynn Watermann" , "Trey Holt" , "Yvonne James-Henderson" , "Tim Stowell" Subject: Re: a couple of items you may wish to know Date: Sat, 13 Feb 1999 17:03:57 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-UIDL: f6b5932bb7c1fa02e5370a236ee0dccd Very nicely put, Tim! piglet (megan zurawicz) ICQ: 18429839 note: was pigolit@ix.netcom.com, now mspiglet@prodigy.net genealogy-- http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~piglet quilting-- http://pages.prodigy.net/mspiglet theatre-- http://members.aol.com/tupacratz/poohpix.htm -----Original Message----- From: Tim Stowell To: Beth Wills ; Betsy ; Bill Oliver ; Bridgett ; Celia Snyder ; Ginger Cisewski ; Jan Craven ; Jim Powell ; Kay Mason ; Kim Harris Myers ; Lynn Watermann ; Megan Zurawicz ; Trey Holt ; Yvonne James-Henderson Date: Saturday, 13 February, 1999 14:01 Subject: a couple of items you may wish to know >My address - Tim Stowell > 4869 Hillsdale Circle > Chattanooga, TN 37416-1225 > > 423.344.0886 > > regular email addy - tstowell@chattanooga.net - home > emergency addy - tstowell@mccallie.org - work > >----------------------------------------------------------------------- >Effective 2/11, I resigned my position with the bylaws committee - > >"Your offer of having me just monitor the list but be a non-voting >ex-officio member may lead your committee to think that my being there in >that capacity lends credibility or official status (whatever that means?) >to your committee, which in my opinion it does not. Since I've now been >elected National Coordinator of the USGenWeb Project and State Coordinator >for Georgia my duties there are going to keep me too busy to continue to >read this list. > >Therefore, please remove me from the list and committee at your earliest >convenience." >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >Tim ------=_NextPart_000_013D_01BF7D2E.FB7FFD60 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re 'bylaws' committee website (2).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re 'bylaws' committee website (2).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.networkone.net (root@mail.networkone.net [209.144.112.75]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA17438 [xxxxxx] Tue, 23 Feb 1999 10:28:42 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (assured-01-103.ln.networkone.net [209.144.118.104]) by mail.networkone.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id IAA21395; Tue, 23 Feb 1999 08:28:56 -0800 Message-Id: <199902231628.IAA21395@mail.networkone.net> From: "Kay Mason" To: "Lynn" , , Tim Stowell Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 08:26:09 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: 'bylaws' committee website Reply-to: kmfkm@ptw.com CC: "Bridgett Smith" , , , , , , , , , , , , Priority: normal In-reply-to: <3.0.5.32.19990223102225.007c5ca0@mail.mccallie.org> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT X-UIDL: f81e934ba87f73f426cf4d52d29505d0 I can't see any reason to leave Jim off.. I can tell you how upset he's going to be that there is discussion going on behind his back. I know, as you-all did it to me just recently! Kay Date sent: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 10:22:25 -0500 To: "Lynn" , From: Tim Stowell Subject: 'bylaws' committee website Copies to: "Bridgett Smith" , , , , , , , , , , , , > I've left Jim off this mail as he is a member of the 'bylaws' committee. > > Thought though that in case you've not seen this site you might be > interested in it: http://wcic.cioe.com/~gizmo/ > > Tim > > USGenWeb Census Project http://www.usgenweb.org/census/ http://www.usgenweb.com/census http://www.usgenweb.net/census/ Montgomery County Mississippi http://www.rootsweb.com/~msmontgo/ Rock County Nebraska http://www.rootsweb.com/~nerock/ ------=_NextPart_000_013D_01BF7D2E.FB7FFD60 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re 'bylaws' committee website (3).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re 'bylaws' committee website (3).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.39]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA20491 [xxxxxx] Tue, 23 Feb 1999 17:46:24 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.70.6.240]) by mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990223234552.HCUL13738@worldnet.att.net>; Tue, 23 Feb 1999 23:45:52 +0000 Message-ID: <36D33DF2.4AFFC2AD@worldnet.att.net> Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 18:46:58 -0500 From: jpowelljr X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net CC: Tim Stowell , kmfkm@ptw.com, Bridgett Smith , bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, betsym@1starnet.com, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com Subject: Re: 'bylaws' committee website References: <36D15C3A.ADD3D828@worldnet.att.net> <3.0.5.32.19990222194829.0080a960@mail.chattanooga.net> <36D29F2C.1D472759@worldnet.att.net> <36D2A9A7.E19DD371@worldnet.att.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: ef92827f44ae7411fbb68d8f6434a1b6 Hi all... I do understand Tim's motives, so the apology wasn't really necessary, but it is accepted and appreciated. I haven't had as much time for the Bylaws Committee as I would like. I have yet to take a moment to check out the page that Tim mentioned. I still believe that they are really wanting to "help". Board members could help them help us. Let them know the little changes you would like to see as individuals. If you wish, ask that they not pass your comments on, or even ask a third party to pass your ideas to the committee. If they actually come up with some changes within the framework of the current Bylaws, we may all be better off. If they fail to come up with anything that passes, I think they still deserve credit for trying to work within the rules and trying to do something positive. I won't mention them again. Thanks for listening, Jim ------=_NextPart_000_013D_01BF7D2E.FB7FFD60 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re 'bylaws' committee website (4).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re 'bylaws' committee website (4).eml" Return-Path: Received: from u3.farm.idt.net (root@u3.farm.idt.net [169.132.8.12]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA25226 [xxxxxx] Tue, 23 Feb 1999 18:03:46 -0600 (CST) Received: from idt.net (ppp-51.ts-1.dc.idt.net [169.132.20.195]) by u3.farm.idt.net (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA24355; Tue, 23 Feb 1999 19:02:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <36D34289.36BF68AE@idt.net> Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 19:06:33 -0500 From: Yvonne James-Henderson Organization: Visit Daisy's Roots! http://www.rootsweb.com/~daisy/1daisy.htm X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: jpowelljr CC: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, Tim Stowell , kmfkm@ptw.com, Bridgett Smith , bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, betsym@1starnet.com, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com Subject: Re: 'bylaws' committee website References: <36D15C3A.ADD3D828@worldnet.att.net> <3.0.5.32.19990222194829.0080a960@mail.chattanooga.net> <36D29F2C.1D472759@worldnet.att.net> <36D2A9A7.E19DD371@worldnet.att.net> <36D33DF2.4AFFC2AD@worldnet.att.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 0f3013feb179c11eab8ffc945c038f98 I feel the AB really needs to be involved somewhat with the grassroots BL committee. Who better than us, would know what is good, bad or ugly in the by-laws. If you haven't lived it like we have (walked the walk), you can't talk the talk. And boy do we know it! Take care, Yvonne in Burke, VA Vive la USGen[xxxxxxx]Web Project! ************************** ------=_NextPart_000_013D_01BF7D2E.FB7FFD60-- [xxxxxxx] Tue Feb 22 13:20:05 2000 [xxxxxxx] Received: from mail1.radix.net (mail1.radix.net [207.192.128.31]) by saltmine.radix.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA14710 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:20:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from [xxxxxx] ([xxxxxx] [199.184.119.1]) by mail1.radix.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA21028 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:20:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (nei-pm2-018.inetnebr.com [206.222.223.92]) by [xxxxxx] (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA15546; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:19:57 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <014b01bf7d61$580b52a0$5cdfdece@default> [xxxxxxx] To: "merope" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:19:21 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0148_01BF7D2F.0D70E2A0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0148_01BF7D2F.0D70E2A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------=_NextPart_000_0148_01BF7D2F.0D70E2A0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re 'bylaws' committee website.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re 'bylaws' committee website.eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.39]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA07575 [xxxxxx] Tue, 23 Feb 1999 09:55:43 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.67.146.181]) by mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990223155510.UBZ13738@worldnet.att.net>; Tue, 23 Feb 1999 15:55:10 +0000 Message-ID: <36D2CF13.25286A35@worldnet.att.net> Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 10:53:56 -0500 From: William N Oliver Reply-To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net Organization: NEGenWeb/OHGenWeb/USGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,nl,de-CH,de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Tim Stowell CC: Lynn , Bridgett Smith , bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, betsym@1starnet.com, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com Subject: Re: 'bylaws' committee website References: <3.0.5.32.19990223102225.007c5ca0@mail.mccallie.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 8e378f499d3c53b841f201524fe79adc Tim Stowell wrote: > I've left Jim off this mail as he is a member of the 'bylaws' committee. > > Thought though that in case you've not seen this site you might be > interested in it: http://wcic.cioe.com/~gizmo/ > > Tim What the heck was the purpose of leaving Jim off the list? REdundancy?? Why make it a point to eliminate him?? Bill -- ------=_NextPart_000_0148_01BF7D2F.0D70E2A0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census (This is very long but please read) (2).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census (This is very long but please read) (2).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc07.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc07.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.42]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA09943 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 07:17:12 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.67.146.130]) by mtiwmhc07.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990216131638.HNKA11074@worldnet.att.net>; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 13:16:38 +0000 Message-ID: <36C96F69.5885DA48@worldnet.att.net> Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 08:15:22 -0500 From: William N Oliver Reply-To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net Organization: NEGenWeb/OHGenWeb/USGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,nl,de-CH,de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Trey Holt CC: Betsy Mills , Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs Subject: Re: Census (This is very long but please read) References: <3.0.3.32.19990216005348.0175c570@txcyber.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 8863bc6e58ee5c5d478471d9173a471e Trey very well done. When everyone has had their say, and you would make a motion to cover what you have said, I would be most pleased to second such motion. I also feel that the second part of the recommendation [posting the 1st paragraph on the project pages] should be a part of the motion. Sincerely, Bill -- Trey Holt wrote: > (First I am going to say that I have not included Kay to recieve this > message but I do think that if the Archive rep is going to participate it > is only fair for the Census Project rep to participate in this discussion.) > ===================== clip ================> > 3. RECOMMENDATION > > I agree with Betsy's basic premis: (suggested language) > > --------- > "We "The USGenWeb Project Advisory Board" want to remind all persons > involved with "The USGenWeb Project" that all original records that are > transcribed and submitted to any special project whether it be "The > USGenWeb Archives Project", "The USGenWeb Census Project", "The USGenWeb > Tombstone Project" or any other special project are a part of The USGenWeb > Project's "digital library" known as "The USGenWeb Project Archives". > > The Board also strongly recommends that the special project named in the > bylaws as "The USGenWeb Archives Project" leave the job of transcribing > original US Census records and recruiting volunteers for the same purpose > to the special project named in the bylaws as "The USGenWeb Census Project" > and that "The USGenWeb Archives Project" should otherwise direct their > efforts to transcribing the other vast volumes of original records that > need to be transcribed in this country. "The USGenWeb Census Project" > should continue to notify the file managers of "The USGenWeb Archives > Project" when new transcriptions are completed so that these files may me > included with original scanned images or other county file structures as > may have been established or deemed neccessary. It is further the > recommendation of this board that at such time "The USGenWeb Census > Project" completes its mission and all US Census original records are > transcribed and uploaded to the "digital library" known as "The USGenWeb > Project Archives" that an assessment should be done of "The USGenWeb > Project Archives" and any duplicated files be combined." > --------- > > I also think that the first paragraph of this recommendation needs to be > added to the special projects page of the website and that on > http://www.usgenweb.org/projects/projects.html the bullets before the > sections that describe the census and tombstone projects should be removed > so that the equal status of all of the special projects as described in the > bylaws is reflected everywhere on the national website. > > Sorry this was so long. I think I covered it all > Thanks > Trey Holt _ Bryan,Texas > holt@txcyber.com | ICQ 5191379 > > The TXGenWeb Project State Coordinator | http://www.rootsweb.com/~txgenweb/ > The Brazos Genealogical Assoc | Brazos Co TXGenWeb Site | > http://www2.cy-net.net/~bga/ > > "The views expressed here are that of Trey Holt and not of The USGenWeb > Project Advisory Board" > ============= clip ===============> ------=_NextPart_000_0148_01BF7D2F.0D70E2A0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census (This is very long but please read).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census (This is very long but please read).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.39]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id GAA05310 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 06:40:18 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.77.213.32]) by mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990216123946.BQVU22890@worldnet.att.net>; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 12:39:46 +0000 Message-ID: <36C96754.2920619C@worldnet.att.net> Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 07:40:52 -0500 From: jpowelljr X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Trey Holt CC: Betsy Mills , Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Bill Oliver , Tim Stowell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs Subject: Re: Census (This is very long but please read) References: <3.0.3.32.19990216005348.0175c570@txcyber.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 720efed7888fdf348090d72f20df7123 There seems to be a consensus coming together here. (Betsy, Bill & Trey) It seems workable. I have talked with those that I deal with in Archives and Census positions and the proposal meets most of their needs (wants). The only problem I see, is that we need a "press" release, citing the problem as we see it and our probable consensus on the issue. Invite comments to be posted (we need a place for volunteer input). Do not put a time limit on comments. At some point we should create a motion based on our input and their input. We want to be taken seriously. I don't believe that will happen until we gain the trust of the Volunteers. The vast majority will stand behind us if we are open and explain our actions to the best of our ability. Everyday we hide behind this curtain, we lose credibility. Jim ------=_NextPart_000_0148_01BF7D2F.0D70E2A0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census mess.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census mess.eml" Return-Path: Received: from dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.3]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA03645 [xxxxxx] Mon, 1 Mar 1999 16:43:24 -0600 (CST) From: cityslic@ix.netcom.com Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id QAA29193; Mon, 1 Mar 1999 16:38:40 -0600 (CST) Received: from tfx-us6-07.ix.netcom.com(204.30.67.199) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma028746; Mon Mar 1 16:36:47 1999 Message-ID: <36DB15C4.402C@ix.netcom.com> Date: Mon, 01 Mar 1999 17:33:40 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-NC320 (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Ms. Piglet" CC: FEATHER2s@aol.com, bascs@snark.wizard.com, bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net Subject: Re: Census mess References: <014301be626b$68c33980$a90b9cd1@william> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 1c95dcf9becf8c46974adddd86074eaa Ms. Piglet wrote: > > > > Linda, that's clearly not the case. The Census Project has *always* been > called the USGenWeb Census Project, and any tracing of continuity will show > that what Kay is doing is the same project. > The only times, once the project was announced, that it was called anything but USGenWeb Archives Census Project was when James Streeter maintained the pages. He finally corrected that after a few months prodding by me (and Ken); and after Kay agreed to take over from Ken. The name flip-flopped after that. When she first agreed, she thought it was a USIGS project. > > You tried to get the Board to order Kay back into the Archives directory > structure and that was not acted on. You then *started* a competing > USGenWeb Archives Census Project. That much has been transparently clear to > anyone watching this. Remind me when I tried to get the Board to order Kay back into the Archives. The action I took recently... setting up Holly's pages in the directory where they should have been from the first... was effective. It got the Board's attention so they would realize there was a problem. > You have now also stated essentially that the Archives reserves the right to > leave the project at any time. This is a statement I've heard you imply > repeatedly, HUH?? Megan.... think back to who said anything like that.. and who said, no way... do NOT leave USGenWeb. > and it's why I've ceased giving the Archives anything, storing > data at the county site alone. But this is the first time I've heard you > come out and say so. You've claimed in the past that this is precisely your > point of conflict with Kay---that you believe she thinks she can take the > Census Project away from USGW at any time she wishes to---and here you're > showing that that is precisely your own approach to the Archives. > Excuse me? Linda ------=_NextPart_000_0148_01BF7D2F.0D70E2A0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (10).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (10).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc05.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc05.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.40]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA09063 [xxxxxx] Thu, 11 Feb 1999 17:15:28 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.70.18.20]) by mtiwmhc05.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990211231456.IVWU8774@worldnet.att.net>; Thu, 11 Feb 1999 23:14:56 +0000 Message-ID: <36C364B0.DB078694@worldnet.att.net> Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 18:16:00 -0500 From: jpowelljr X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: FEATHER2s@aol.com CC: tstowell@mccallie.org, bascs@snark.wizard.com, bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jcraven@usunwired.net, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com Subject: Re: Census Project References: <60b11873.36c35d13@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: c788b95acca04c9a692e4a8e6f12a5ea FEATHER2s@aol.com wrote: Can the board as a whole ask Tim to do so? Can Tim say, "I would like to try my hand at mediating this problem if there are no objections by the Board", and then if there are no objections, do so? Would this not be the Board giving its "ok". I'm not sure of the Parliamentary rules on this but many chairmen of committees I have been part of have used this tactic. Jim > > It would seem from reading the above excerpt that the NC is not given the > power to actually mediate disputes. That power is given only to the Board as > a whole. > > JMO, > > Ginger -- Jim and Debbie Powell Family History Surname Connections Kentucky..POWELL..MADISON..CLAYTON..WINSTEAD..BOURLAND..HIBBS UTLEY..EARLE..BUNTIN..MOORE..WILLIAMS..TAPP..WICKLIFFE North Carolina/South Carolina..WATKINS..GADDY..NORWOOD..CROUCH REYNOLDS..BOYD..McGEE..WHITTLE..MADISON..CLAYTON WINSTEAD..BOURLAND..TAPP..FOWLER Virginia..OWEN New York/New Jersey..McCLELLAN..LaPAGE Georgia/Florida..HARRIS..HODGE..FOWLER Email: Jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net Family Homepage: Http://www.afn.org/~afn03098/ For slower connections: Http://www.afn.org/~afn04266/ Coordinator of Henderson County KyGenweb Page Http://www.rootsweb.com/~kyhender/ Coordinator of Gilchrist County FLGenWeb Page Http://www.rootsweb.com/~flgilchr/ Coordinator of Alachua County FLGenWeb Page Http://www.rootsweb.com/~flalachu/ Assistant State Coordinator FLGenWeb ------=_NextPart_000_0148_01BF7D2F.0D70E2A0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (11).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (11).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc05.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc05.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.40]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA20962 [xxxxxx] Thu, 11 Feb 1999 18:00:02 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.67.128.62]) by mtiwmhc05.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990211235930.JKMW8774@worldnet.att.net>; Thu, 11 Feb 1999 23:59:30 +0000 Message-ID: <36C36EA1.4FBC1228@worldnet.att.net> Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 18:58:25 -0500 From: William N Oliver Reply-To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net Organization: NEGenWeb/OHGenWeb/USGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,nl,de-CH,de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Tim Stowell CC: Bridgett Smith , bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, betsym@1starnet.com Subject: Re: Census Project References: <3.0.5.32.19990210215621.008309c0@mail.mccallie.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: f7bd56161be35c6300b9b07372b6acc1 Tim Stowell wrote: > In response to, I believe it was Bill's suggestion, I've written both > parties asking them to share their version of events with me. Of course if > ya'll decide I should do this another way, please let me know. > > I'm trying to come to an understanding of all sides of this, much like > Yvonne! From what I've heard so far - still want to get some facts - I've > got a quasi idea forming. > > I was surprised that most of the Board was in the dark on this. > ============== snip ================> > > > G'day Tim, You invited response. First, it has to be admitted that it was not my suggestion, but rather Trey's suggestion. Second, whether it has merit or not you have already put your plan into action and made "quasi" conclusions. Thirdly, you ask if it is not what the AB wants to let you know. Still you have already proceeded. The AB is more than several individuals and at this writing my mailbox has received no responses on your post from any of those individuals. >From the B/Ls the NC is not given arbitration authority [Art VI]. The AB by VI, sec 3 is given that authority. By presuming action to Trey's suggestion you have overstepped the office. A point that may have been overlooked: there is no grievance filed before the AB, thus, some of this is mote. Thus, it is something still between two individual Project Managers. There is plenty of unfinished business in "dry dock". Sincerely, Bill -- ------=_NextPart_000_0148_01BF7D2F.0D70E2A0-- [xxxxxxx] Tue Feb 22 13:20:55 2000 [xxxxxxx] Received: from mail1.radix.net (mail1.radix.net [207.192.128.31]) by saltmine.radix.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA14758 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:20:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from [xxxxxx] ([xxxxxx] [199.184.119.1]) by mail1.radix.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA21169 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:20:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (nei-pm2-018.inetnebr.com [206.222.223.92]) by [xxxxxx] (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA15818; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:20:25 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <015601bf7d61$68f74b00$5cdfdece@default> [xxxxxxx] To: "merope" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:19:49 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0153_01BF7D2F.1E5CDB00" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0153_01BF7D2F.1E5CDB00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------=_NextPart_000_0153_01BF7D2F.1E5CDB00 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (12).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (12).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.1starnet.com (1starnet.com [207.243.104.17]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id SAA29892 [xxxxxx] Thu, 11 Feb 1999 18:32:07 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199902120032.SAA29892@[xxxxxx]> Received: from betsy [207.243.104.127] by mail.1starnet.com (SMTPD32-4.06) id A6601F0138; Thu, 11 Feb 1999 18:31:28 CST X-Sender: betsym@1starnet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0.1 Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 18:27:57 -0600 To: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Kay Mason , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Bill Oliver , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann From: Betsy Mills Subject: Re: Census Project In-Reply-To: <36C36EA1.4FBC1228@worldnet.att.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19990210215621.008309c0@mail.mccallie.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: c1253d7864144d82c57b63bd873391dc Oh good grief! I am sorry, but this is getting ridiculous. Tim seems to be trying his best to do what the "board" wants him to do and is getting shot for every move he makes. He stated that he had asked for both sides of the issue from the two parties. He didn't state that he was going to mediate it himself. It is my belief that there is nothing wrong with any ONE of us having done the same thing. I personally beleive that it was more appropriate for the NC to do the asking. Maybe he plans to ask a couple of people who are unbiased (if he can find some) to look at the answers he receives and make some suggestions. Maybe he was going to bring it to the whole board (minus Kay) and ask for suggestions. Folks, it is time to give Tim a chance and quit jumping on every move he makes. We can NOT fight internally. I am beginning to hear several of our good volunteers talking about quitting. This reminds me of King Solomon. The good people who are quitting are the ones who would rather quit than see the "baby" cut in half. We have been working well together as a group. I really believe Tim and Jim have no other reason for serving on this board than to be a part of and help the Project that they love and believe in. Thanks for listening! Betsy At 06:58 PM 02/11/1999 -0500, you wrote: >Tim Stowell wrote: > >> In response to, I believe it was Bill's suggestion, I've written both >> parties asking them to share their version of events with me. Of course if >> ya'll decide I should do this another way, please let me know. >> >> I'm trying to come to an understanding of all sides of this, much like >> Yvonne! From what I've heard so far - still want to get some facts - I've >> got a quasi idea forming. >> >> I was surprised that most of the Board was in the dark on this. >> > >============== snip ================> > >> >> > > >G'day Tim, > >You invited response. First, it has to be admitted that it was not my >suggestion, but rather Trey's suggestion. Second, whether it has merit or not >you have already put your plan into action and made "quasi" conclusions. >Thirdly, you ask if it is not what the AB wants to let you know. Still you >have already proceeded. > >The AB is more than several individuals and at this writing my mailbox has >received no responses on your post from any of those individuals. > >>From the B/Ls the NC is not given arbitration authority [Art VI]. The AB by >VI, sec 3 is given that authority. By presuming action to Trey's suggestion >you have overstepped the office. > >A point that may have been overlooked: there is no grievance filed before the >AB, thus, some of this is mote. Thus, it is something still between two >individual Project Managers. > >There is plenty of unfinished business in "dry dock". > >Sincerely, > >Bill >-- > ------=_NextPart_000_0153_01BF7D2F.1E5CDB00 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (13).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (13).eml" Return-Path: Received: from imo25.mx.aol.com (imo25.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.69]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA02232 [xxxxxx] Thu, 11 Feb 1999 22:26:23 -0600 (CST) From: FEATHER2s@aol.com Received: from FEATHER2s@aol.com by imo25.mx.aol.com (IMOv18.1) id 0WQZa20321; Thu, 11 Feb 1999 23:09:59 +1900 (EST) Message-ID: <111c14da.36c3a997@aol.com> Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 23:09:59 EST To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, tstowell@mccallie.org Cc: bascs@snark.wizard.com, bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, betsym@1starnet.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Census Project Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 205 X-UIDL: 4c515f1d2eefe683c52e36d403924baa Whatever else we do, we need to actually get on with the business of "taking care of business" and we haven't done anything to date... Seems the easiest task to tackle of those left unfinished would be to re- activate the motion to appoint a secretary. How about it? Let's accomplish something for a change, instead of just marking time...! Ginger ------=_NextPart_000_0153_01BF7D2F.1E5CDB00 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (14).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (14).eml" Return-Path: Received: from u1.farm.idt.net (root@u1.farm.idt.net [169.132.8.10]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA29848 [xxxxxx] Mon, 15 Feb 1999 21:45:45 -0600 (CST) Received: from idt.net (ppp-58.ts-1.dc.idt.net [169.132.20.202]) by u1.farm.idt.net (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA06538; Mon, 15 Feb 1999 22:43:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <36C8EA0A.EC37620A@idt.net> Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 22:46:18 -0500 From: Yvonne James-Henderson Organization: Visit Daisy's Roots! http://www.rootsweb.com/~daisy/1daisy.htm X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Betsy Mills CC: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Pam Reid , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Bill Oliver , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs Subject: Re: Census Project References: <199902160321.WAA05978@mail-relay3.idt.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: cbdea1e5c588ceccd7497000b7d45891 You may be right Betsy, but I will say one more thing on the subject and that is Linda was the originator of the Census Project and hired Kay. In essence, Kay has taken it over and fired her boss, I am sorry but I have a REAL problem with that. Take care, Yvonne in Burke, VA ------=_NextPart_000_0153_01BF7D2F.1E5CDB00 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (15).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (15).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.39]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA03667 [xxxxxx] Mon, 15 Feb 1999 21:59:58 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.67.148.223]) by mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990216035923.FHXJ8571@worldnet.att.net>; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 03:59:23 +0000 Message-ID: <36C8ECDD.B1F62566@worldnet.att.net> Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 22:58:22 -0500 From: William N Oliver Reply-To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net Organization: NEGenWeb/OHGenWeb/USGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,nl,de-CH,de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Betsy Mills CC: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs Subject: Re: Census Project References: <19990216032126.QJNI17975@mail.1starnet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: eeb3b3a1b42ffe1e02b8dffa55588bfc Betsy and Board members, It seems that there is one more fire that must be dealt with. When will we as Leadership get together as one and put a foot down?? I certainly agree with most of your points, plus what is below. My support is for the idea that there should be only one "Census Project". Further, my support goes for the USGW Census Project Manager/Coordinator, Kay Mason, to continue the project as she has been doing. It seems to me that as Kay Mason became the Census Project Manager, it is hers to management and the Board should support that. Especially since there does not seem to be any restriction to the main goal of free access to information. It seems that the CPM has listened to comments and made adjustments to pages in copyright and credit where credit is due. Thus, what grounds is there to ask for a resignation? There was mention that no one could find the information because it was not in with the "archives" and couldn't be searched. If I recall talk from RW, search engines are in the making to handle any such problem. So, again what problem?? Detail; if memory serves correctly, it was Ken Hollingsworth who turned the reins over to Kay. The most important point is simply that when projects become quite large, there is nothing wrong with separation. Like sending a child out when they mature. Certainly no one is saying Linda hasn't been a good manager of the archives. Finally, even if the AB asked for resignations from either or both Project managers, I read the BLs to say it can't be forced. Only their respective boards can do that. Sincerely, Bill -- ==========================================> > Kay is NOT cc:ed on this message for obvious reasons. I ask that no board > member forward a copy of this to her either. > > Okay, do we now ask Linda's supporters to forward their complaints about > Kay to this list??? This has to stop and the board has to stop it. This > is threatening to split the archives and this whole project right down the > middle. > > The only hope for this situation is for Kay to continue to do her own thing > and continue to submit a text copy for uploading to the appropriate county > directory in the archives and for Linda to remove the Archives Census > Project pages and to quit soliciting volunteers. The only other > alternative is to ask for the resignation of both Kay and Linda. > > This demanding to remove files from each others directories is ludicrous > and goes against the "free" use by the USGenWeb Project that is one of the > founding principals of this project. It must be all for one and one for > all or we are dead in the water, folks. > > Are we going to allow Kay and Linda to tear this project apart or are we > going to stop this now??? > > Betsy ------=_NextPart_000_0153_01BF7D2F.1E5CDB00 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (16).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (16).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.1starnet.com (1starnet.com [207.243.104.17]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id WAA06131 [xxxxxx] Mon, 15 Feb 1999 22:09:47 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199902160409.WAA06131@[xxxxxx]> Received: from betsy [207.243.104.155] by mail.1starnet.com (SMTPD32-4.06) id AF7D1D50100; Mon, 15 Feb 1999 22:09:33 CST X-Sender: betsym@1starnet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0.1 Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 22:05:58 -0600 To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net From: Betsy Mills Subject: Re: Census Project Cc: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs In-Reply-To: <36C8ECDD.B1F62566@worldnet.att.net> References: <19990216032126.QJNI17975@mail.1starnet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: ef4452efec0aa727dbfa56f6f3681205 So, are you going to ask that all census transcriptions be removed from the archives??? They have been uploaded to many of the county directories - not to a separate directory as Kay is doing now. Are you going to REMOVE all the files that are in the archives???? I think not. So, you will continue to have two copies of the census files. Okay, so they are backed up. Exactly WHAT are you suggesting we put our foot down about then?? My solution was to calm the waters, not make them worse. Kay has her project and the archives receives a copy of the text file to upload to the archives in the county directory. Linda removes her census pages that are only a table of contents specific to the census and quits soliciting volunteers for HER census project and continues as the archives manager. What is your solution?? Betsy At 10:58 PM 02/15/1999 -0500, William N Oliver wrote: >Betsy and Board members, > >It seems that there is one more fire that must be dealt with. When will we as >Leadership get together as one and put a foot down?? I certainly agree with >most of your points, plus what is below. > >My support is for the idea that there should be only one "Census Project". >Further, my support goes for the USGW Census Project Manager/Coordinator, Kay >Mason, to continue the project as she has been doing. > >It seems to me that as Kay Mason became the Census Project Manager, it is hers >to management and the Board should support that. Especially since there does >not seem to be any restriction to the main goal of free access to information. > >It seems that the CPM has listened to comments and made adjustments to pages in >copyright and credit where credit is due. Thus, what grounds is there to ask >for a resignation? > >There was mention that no one could find the information because it was not in >with the "archives" and couldn't be searched. If I recall talk from RW, search >engines are in the making to handle any such problem. So, again what problem?? > >Detail; if memory serves correctly, it was Ken Hollingsworth who turned the >reins over to Kay. The most important point is simply that when projects >become quite large, there is nothing wrong with separation. Like sending a >child out when they mature. Certainly no one is saying Linda hasn't been a >good manager of the archives. > >Finally, even if the AB asked for resignations from either or both Project >managers, I read the BLs to say it can't be forced. Only their respective >boards can do that. > >Sincerely, > >Bill >-- >==========================================> > >> Kay is NOT cc:ed on this message for obvious reasons. I ask that no board >> member forward a copy of this to her either. >> >> Okay, do we now ask Linda's supporters to forward their complaints about >> Kay to this list??? This has to stop and the board has to stop it. This >> is threatening to split the archives and this whole project right down the >> middle. >> >> The only hope for this situation is for Kay to continue to do her own thing >> and continue to submit a text copy for uploading to the appropriate county >> directory in the archives and for Linda to remove the Archives Census >> Project pages and to quit soliciting volunteers. The only other >> alternative is to ask for the resignation of both Kay and Linda. >> >> This demanding to remove files from each others directories is ludicrous >> and goes against the "free" use by the USGenWeb Project that is one of the >> founding principals of this project. It must be all for one and one for >> all or we are dead in the water, folks. >> >> Are we going to allow Kay and Linda to tear this project apart or are we >> going to stop this now??? >> >> Betsy > ------=_NextPart_000_0153_01BF7D2F.1E5CDB00 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (17).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (17).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.39]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA11162 [xxxxxx] Mon, 15 Feb 1999 22:29:20 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.67.148.223]) by mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990216042848.FUTL8571@worldnet.att.net>; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 04:28:48 +0000 Message-ID: <36C8F3C0.74EC0577@worldnet.att.net> Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 23:27:45 -0500 From: William N Oliver Reply-To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net Organization: NEGenWeb/OHGenWeb/USGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,nl,de-CH,de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Betsy Mills CC: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs Subject: Re: Census Project References: <19990216032126.QJNI17975@mail.1starnet.com> <19990216041017.HBDS2726@mail.1starnet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: c331d24c102b88c4ac09b5a00aeea293 Betsy, if I wasn't clear, I was agreeing with: "Kay has her project and the archives receives a copy of the text file to upload to the archives in the county directory. Linda removes her census pages that are only a table of contents specific to the census and quits soliciting volunteers for HER census project and continues as the archives manager." Bill -- Betsy Mills wrote: > So, are you going to ask that all census transcriptions be removed from the > archives??? They have been uploaded to many of the county directories - > not to > a separate directory as Kay is doing now. Are you going to REMOVE all the > files that are in the archives???? I think not. So, you will continue to > have > two copies of the census files. Okay, so they are backed up. > > Exactly WHAT are you suggesting we put our foot down about then?? My solution > was to calm the waters, not make them worse. Kay has her project and the > archives receives a copy of the text file to upload to the archives in the > county directory. Linda removes her census pages that are only a table of > contents specific to the census and quits soliciting volunteers for HER census > project and continues as the archives manager. > > What is your solution?? > > Betsy > > At 10:58 PM 02/15/1999 -0500, William N Oliver wrote: > >Betsy and Board members, > > > >It seems that there is one more fire that must be dealt with. When will > we as > >Leadership get together as one and put a foot down?? I certainly agree with > >most of your points, plus what is below. > > > >My support is for the idea that there should be only one "Census Project". > >Further, my support goes for the USGW Census Project Manager/Coordinator, Kay > >Mason, to continue the project as she has been doing. > > > >It seems to me that as Kay Mason became the Census Project Manager, it is > hers > >to management and the Board should support that. Especially since there does > >not seem to be any restriction to the main goal of free access to > information. > > > >It seems that the CPM has listened to comments and made adjustments to pages > in > >copyright and credit where credit is due. Thus, what grounds is there to ask > >for a resignation? > > > >There was mention that no one could find the information because it was > not in > >with the "archives" and couldn't be searched. If I recall talk from RW, > search > >engines are in the making to handle any such problem. So, again what > problem?? > > > >Detail; if memory serves correctly, it was Ken Hollingsworth who turned the > >reins over to Kay. The most important point is simply that when projects > >become quite large, there is nothing wrong with separation. Like sending a > >child out when they mature. Certainly no one is saying Linda hasn't been a > >good manager of the archives. > > > >Finally, even if the AB asked for resignations from either or both Project > >managers, I read the BLs to say it can't be forced. Only their respective > >boards can do that. > > > >Sincerely, > > > >Bill > >-- > >==========================================> > > > >> Kay is NOT cc:ed on this message for obvious reasons. I ask that no board > >> member forward a copy of this to her either. > >> > >> Okay, do we now ask Linda's supporters to forward their complaints about > >> Kay to this list??? This has to stop and the board has to stop it. This > >> is threatening to split the archives and this whole project right down the > >> middle. > >> > >> The only hope for this situation is for Kay to continue to do her own thing > >> and continue to submit a text copy for uploading to the appropriate county > >> directory in the archives and for Linda to remove the Archives Census > >> Project pages and to quit soliciting volunteers. The only other > >> alternative is to ask for the resignation of both Kay and Linda. > >> > >> This demanding to remove files from each others directories is ludicrous > >> and goes against the "free" use by the USGenWeb Project that is one of the > >> founding principals of this project. It must be all for one and one for > >> all or we are dead in the water, folks. > >> > >> Are we going to allow Kay and Linda to tear this project apart or are we > >> going to stop this now??? > >> > >> Betsy > > ------=_NextPart_000_0153_01BF7D2F.1E5CDB00-- [xxxxxxx] Tue Feb 22 13:21:22 2000 [xxxxxxx] Received: from mail1.radix.net (mail1.radix.net [207.192.128.31]) by saltmine.radix.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA14819 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:21:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from [xxxxxx] ([xxxxxx] [199.184.119.1]) by mail1.radix.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA21256 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:21:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (nei-pm2-018.inetnebr.com [206.222.223.92]) by [xxxxxx] (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA16201; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:21:07 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <016101bf7d61$821cf9e0$5cdfdece@default> [xxxxxxx] To: "merope" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:20:32 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_015E_01BF7D2F.378289E0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_015E_01BF7D2F.378289E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------=_NextPart_000_015E_01BF7D2F.378289E0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (18).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (18).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.1starnet.com (1starnet.com [207.243.104.17]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id WAA17431 [xxxxxx] Mon, 15 Feb 1999 22:54:05 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199902160454.WAA17431@[xxxxxx]> Received: from betsy [207.243.104.155] by mail.1starnet.com (SMTPD32-4.06) id A9D91450112; Mon, 15 Feb 1999 22:53:45 CST X-Sender: betsym@1starnet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0.1 Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 22:50:09 -0600 To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net From: Betsy Mills Subject: Re: Census Project Cc: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs In-Reply-To: <36C8F3C0.74EC0577@worldnet.att.net> References: <19990216032126.QJNI17975@mail.1starnet.com> <19990216041017.HBDS2726@mail.1starnet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: 7523a377be93b527c87f1bb5d0cb5dcf Thanks, Bill. I apologize. I did read something else in there that I obviously shouldn't have read into it. Betsy At 11:27 PM 02/15/1999 -0500, William N Oliver wrote: >Betsy, if I wasn't clear, I was agreeing with: "Kay has her project and the >archives receives a copy of the text file to upload to the archives in the >county directory. Linda removes her census pages that are only a table of >contents specific to the census and quits soliciting volunteers for HER census >project and continues as the archives manager." > >Bill >-- > > > > >Betsy Mills wrote: > >> So, are you going to ask that all census transcriptions be removed from the >> archives??? They have been uploaded to many of the county directories - >> not to >> a separate directory as Kay is doing now. Are you going to REMOVE all the >> files that are in the archives???? I think not. So, you will continue to >> have >> two copies of the census files. Okay, so they are backed up. >> >> Exactly WHAT are you suggesting we put our foot down about then?? My solution >> was to calm the waters, not make them worse. Kay has her project and the >> archives receives a copy of the text file to upload to the archives in the >> county directory. Linda removes her census pages that are only a table of >> contents specific to the census and quits soliciting volunteers for HER census >> project and continues as the archives manager. >> >> What is your solution?? >> >> Betsy >> >> At 10:58 PM 02/15/1999 -0500, William N Oliver wrote: >> >Betsy and Board members, >> > >> >It seems that there is one more fire that must be dealt with. When will >> we as >> >Leadership get together as one and put a foot down?? I certainly agree with >> >most of your points, plus what is below. >> > >> >My support is for the idea that there should be only one "Census Project". >> >Further, my support goes for the USGW Census Project Manager/Coordinator, Kay >> >Mason, to continue the project as she has been doing. >> > >> >It seems to me that as Kay Mason became the Census Project Manager, it is >> hers >> >to management and the Board should support that. Especially since there does >> >not seem to be any restriction to the main goal of free access to >> information. >> > >> >It seems that the CPM has listened to comments and made adjustments to pages >> in >> >copyright and credit where credit is due. Thus, what grounds is there to ask >> >for a resignation? >> > >> >There was mention that no one could find the information because it was >> not in >> >with the "archives" and couldn't be searched. If I recall talk from RW, >> search >> >engines are in the making to handle any such problem. So, again what >> problem?? >> > >> >Detail; if memory serves correctly, it was Ken Hollingsworth who turned the >> >reins over to Kay. The most important point is simply that when projects >> >become quite large, there is nothing wrong with separation. Like sending a >> >child out when they mature. Certainly no one is saying Linda hasn't been a >> >good manager of the archives. >> > >> >Finally, even if the AB asked for resignations from either or both Project >> >managers, I read the BLs to say it can't be forced. Only their respective >> >boards can do that. >> > >> >Sincerely, >> > >> >Bill >> >-- >> >==========================================> >> > >> >> Kay is NOT cc:ed on this message for obvious reasons. I ask that no board >> >> member forward a copy of this to her either. >> >> >> >> Okay, do we now ask Linda's supporters to forward their complaints about >> >> Kay to this list??? This has to stop and the board has to stop it. This >> >> is threatening to split the archives and this whole project right down the >> >> middle. >> >> >> >> The only hope for this situation is for Kay to continue to do her own thing >> >> and continue to submit a text copy for uploading to the appropriate county >> >> directory in the archives and for Linda to remove the Archives Census >> >> Project pages and to quit soliciting volunteers. The only other >> >> alternative is to ask for the resignation of both Kay and Linda. >> >> >> >> This demanding to remove files from each others directories is ludicrous >> >> and goes against the "free" use by the USGenWeb Project that is one of the >> >> founding principals of this project. It must be all for one and one for >> >> all or we are dead in the water, folks. >> >> >> >> Are we going to allow Kay and Linda to tear this project apart or are we >> >> going to stop this now??? >> >> >> >> Betsy >> > > ------=_NextPart_000_015E_01BF7D2F.378289E0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (19).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (19).eml" Return-Path: Received: from jubjub.wizard.com (jubjub.wizard.com [199.171.28.9]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA26527 [xxxxxx] Mon, 15 Feb 1999 23:36:11 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (pm3-5-036.wizard.com [208.211.53.36]) by jubjub.wizard.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id VAA02158; Mon, 15 Feb 1999 21:41:36 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199902160541.VAA02158@jubjub.wizard.com> From: "Bridgett Smith" To: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Bill Oliver , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , Betsy Mills Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 21:33:52 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Census Project Priority: normal In-reply-to: <199902160321.TAA20081@snark.wizard.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) X-UIDL: 3d1d9c620c842e8cd508c8fc8fd94058 On 15 Feb 99, at 21:16, Betsy Mills wrote: > Kay is NOT cc:ed on this message for obvious reasons. I ask that no board > member forward a copy of this to her either. > > Okay, do we now ask Linda's supporters to forward their complaints about > Kay to this list??? This has to stop and the board has to stop it. This > is threatening to split the archives and this whole project right down the > middle. > I doubt very seriously that Kay instigated all these messages, have an idea a few folks got together and decided to do this (I have been known to be naive on some things tho ) Betsy, are you saying that however the Archives Project goes, so goes the entire project? I think that is putting emphasis on one area of this project a little too much. I will say right up front, that I can see the need for an area to upload data to find information on your ancestors. I have no problem with that at all; however, I am not a gung-ho, yea yea go go Archives person. I do tell folks they can submit info there but I don't go pushing the archives. That is just me. I am not involved in any of the archive projects, and don't care to be because of time constraints not because of any other reason. Given that fact, my answers/replies/comments may seem off the wall > The only hope for this situation is for Kay to continue to do her own > thing and continue to submit a text copy for uploading to the appropriate > county directory in the archives and for Linda to remove the Archives > Census Project pages and to quit soliciting volunteers. The only other > alternative is to ask for the resignation of both Kay and Linda. > In other words, split the census project away from the Archives project, and have it as a "stand alone" project? But I feel that if we decide this that Linda will have no part of that decision. In turn if you splinter the census project, will S-K Publications honor this split and continue to send in the images in to be uploaded to the census project? You have a lot to ponder on this, those images are a "bonus" for researchers. Speaking of researchers, this is why the USGenWeb Project was started, and I think any solution we come up with the researchers need to be top priority in any decision. Personally I think we need to make everyone aware they need to get rid of the *I* syndrome and think about the "customers". The "customers" don't give a darn about who is running what or even where it is stored, nor any of the inner workings of this project -- all they care about is the ease of access. I see no reason why Linda could not just have a link to the USGenWeb Archives Project (Kay's version) -- JMHO. I would probably say the same thing if the Tombstone or any other project decides to have their own special place. It is specialized research so why shouldn't it? > This demanding to remove files from each others directories is ludicrous > and goes against the "free" use by the USGenWeb Project that is one of the > founding principals of this project. It must be all for one and one for > all or we are dead in the water, folks. > It is ludicrous, I agree, with one demanding one thing and the other one not demanding too much. Seems to me that Kay has taken care of every obsticle or "demand" made (Holly's name is back on the pages) and if the Kay's people are informing Linda's people of new census online, if they want to copy them to their directory, what is the problem? We talk about "poor" Rootsweb having double files on their server. It is my humble opinion that if they were concerned over that they would not have issued Kay another directory. I am sure if they thought there was an inkling of a problem they would have asked Linda about the "new" directory for the census project. That part is a RW problem and not ours. > Are we going to allow Kay and Linda to tear this project apart or are we > going to stop this now??? > What both those folks are doing is showing their tails right now, and if they want to do that -- it is fine by me. However, I don't think that those two are capable of tearing the USGenWeb Project apart, if so then both have too much influence for the good of the project. My solution was above, mixed in with my rhetoric. The Census Project may have been Linda's "baby" but it is growing into it's own and Linda should let loose of the apron strings. Bridgett Bridgett Smith SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region bascs@wizard.com *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* TNGenWeb State Coordinator http://www.tngenweb.org/ ------=_NextPart_000_015E_01BF7D2F.378289E0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (20).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (20).eml" Return-Path: Received: from pimout2-int.prodigy.net (pimout2-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.59.113]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id BAA08826 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 01:05:22 -0600 (CST) Received: from william (CHCGB106-03.splitrock.net [209.156.10.187]) by pimout2-int.prodigy.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id CAA112118; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 02:04:38 -0500 Message-ID: <005a01be597a$0a926100$bb0a9cd1@william> From: "Ms. Piglet" To: "Jan Craven" , "Bridgett Smith" , "Pam Reid" , "Yvonne James-Henderson" , "Celia Snyder" , "Beth Wills" , "Ginger Cisewski" , "Kim Harris-Myers" , "Trey Holt" , "Bill Oliver" , "Betsy Mills" , "Tim Stowell" , "Jim Powell" , "Lynn Watermann" , "Bonnie McVicar-Briggs" Subject: Re: Census Project Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 01:00:24 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-UIDL: 300ef2ea35b6d8333fd05593426dbfb2 I have said before that I have no particular problem with the census project being separate from the archives. I *do* have a problem with the idea that Kay just decided one day that she didn't want to be a part of the archives any more (and the census project *was* a subdivision of the archives when she inherited it), and therefore removed the project from the archives without the permission of the archives coordinator, the board, or anyone else. I *also* have a problem with Linda's attitude that she will simply ignore Kay and make a new census project in the archives. It appears to me that what started as a personal problem between the two (whether or not Linda would be allowed to tell Kay what to do) has gone on to become a major mess with a lot of people involved. Linda says that the archives (as opposed to the CP) have a contract with SK concerning the images. I don't know if that's a verbal or written contract; if a written contract, I don't know what it specifies. We may need to follow up on that specifically. Linda also says that the archives have a contract with RootsWeb, and has repeatedly given me to understand that in the unlikely event that the board would direct that the archives be removed from RootsWeb, her response would be to remove the archives from the Project and keep them at RW. Again, I don't know the nature of this contract nor what it specifies. I mention this only as evidence that I think the problem goes deeper than the surface---other than their personal conflicts, it appears to me that both ladies deeply believe that when push comes to shove, the projects they head are *theirs* to decide what to do with, and should the board direct them to do other than what they want to do, the board will be ignored. I think we should be aware of this, because the odds are that if we direct anything, we'll end up directing one or the other to do something she does not wish to do. We should go into that having a clear view of what our next move is if we are ignored or defied. I do *not* want us to go into a situation where we attempt to sort out the problem, get ignored, and then say "oh, well, we tried.....you're right, we have no power at all, and can't tell anybody what to do." That would do inestimable damage to not only this board but all future boards. piglet (megan zurawicz) ICQ: 18429839 note: was pigolit@ix.netcom.com, now mspiglet@prodigy.net genealogy-- http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~piglet quilting-- http://pages.prodigy.net/mspiglet theatre-- http://members.aol.com/tupacratz/poohpix.htm -----Original Message----- From: Betsy Mills To: Jan Craven ; Bridgett Smith ; Pam Reid ; Yvonne James-Henderson ; Celia Snyder ; Beth Wills ; Ginger Cisewski ; Kim Harris-Myers ; Trey Holt ; Bill Oliver ; Betsy Mills ; Tim Stowell ; Jim Powell ; Megan Zurawicz ; Lynn Watermann ; Bonnie McVicar-Briggs Date: Monday, 15 February, 1999 21:23 Subject: Census Project >Kay is NOT cc:ed on this message for obvious reasons. I ask that no board >member forward a copy of this to her either. > >Okay, do we now ask Linda's supporters to forward their complaints about >Kay to this list??? This has to stop and the board has to stop it. This >is threatening to split the archives and this whole project right down the >middle. > >The only hope for this situation is for Kay to continue to do her own thing >and continue to submit a text copy for uploading to the appropriate county >directory in the archives and for Linda to remove the Archives Census >Project pages and to quit soliciting volunteers. The only other >alternative is to ask for the resignation of both Kay and Linda. > >This demanding to remove files from each others directories is ludicrous >and goes against the "free" use by the USGenWeb Project that is one of the >founding principals of this project. It must be all for one and one for >all or we are dead in the water, folks. > >Are we going to allow Kay and Linda to tear this project apart or are we >going to stop this now??? > >Betsy > ------=_NextPart_000_015E_01BF7D2F.378289E0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (21).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (21).eml" Return-Path: Received: from imo12.mx.aol.com (imo12.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.2]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id GAA05017 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 06:37:52 -0600 (CST) From: FEATHER2s@aol.com Received: from FEATHER2s@aol.com by imo12.mx.aol.com (IMOv18.1) id NLGMa04795; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 07:33:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1b7ca347.36c9658e@aol.com> Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 07:33:18 EST To: betsym@1starnet.com, jcraven@usunwired.net, bascs@snark.wizard.com, pamreid@dc.jones.com, hen1@IDT.NET, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, bwills@ionia-mi.net, estral@switchboard.net, holt@txcyber.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, tstowell@mccallie.org, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Census Project Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 205 X-UIDL: 93ff3154de6b39c2ca95cd35c9239ad3 Good morning all, In typical AOL fashion, I stopped receiving email at about 9 p.m. last night, and then when I logged on this morning at 5:30 my email "overfloweth." I'm still trying to digest all this, so if I ramble, please forgive. <> I think this is an excellent idea, but I also think we should remove the Archives Rep from these discussions .. (Sorry, Jan. No offense intended!) As a simple matter of "impartiality" it seems unfair for the Archives Rep to be present while this is under discussion, especially when the Census Rep is not... I admit I have had no experience with either the Archives or Census, but it does seem that a project that was once quite small and struggling has now become a large, busy and very productive "project within the project" and it makes total sense to me to have removed that to a separate directory. I expect (and hope) that other Special Projects will also outgrow the Archives at some point and need to be separated, simply for convenience of the volunteers working within them if nothing else. Trey's suggested statement was very well written, and I suggest that we come to a consensus and issue a "formal statement" - Trey's or one similar - very soon. If we delay action and wait for this to resolve itself it won't, and in the meantime we are wasting and abusing our most valuable resource - our volunteers! Ginger ------=_NextPart_000_015E_01BF7D2F.378289E0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (22).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (22).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc07.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc07.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.42]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id GAA05172 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 06:39:24 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.67.146.130]) by mtiwmhc07.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990216123852.HGBE11074@worldnet.att.net>; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 12:38:52 +0000 Message-ID: <36C96690.3439DA98@worldnet.att.net> Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 07:37:37 -0500 From: William N Oliver Reply-To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net Organization: NEGenWeb/OHGenWeb/USGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,nl,de-CH,de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bridgett Smith CC: Jan Craven , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs Subject: Re: Census Project References: <199902160541.VAA02158@jubjub.wizard.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: b7b0d2e52f4ab1024dc31e7365c1a78e Bridgett Smith wrote: > On 15 Feb 99, at 21:16, Betsy Mills wrote: > > > Kay is NOT cc:ed on this message for obvious reasons. I ask that no board > > member forward a copy of this to her either. > > > > Okay, do we now ask Linda's supporters to forward their complaints about > > Kay to this list??? This has to stop and the board has to stop it. This > > is threatening to split the archives and this whole project right down the > > middle. > > > > I doubt very seriously that Kay instigated all these messages, have > an idea a few folks got together and decided to do this (I have been > known to be naive on some things tho ) > > Betsy, are you saying that however the Archives Project goes, so > goes the entire project? I think that is putting emphasis on one area > of this project a little too much. > > I will say right up front, that I can see the need for an area to upload > data to find information on your ancestors. I have no problem with > that at all; however, I am not a gung-ho, yea yea go go Archives > person. I do tell folks they can submit info there but I don't go > pushing the archives. That is just me. I am not involved in any of the > archive projects, and don't care to be because of time constraints > not because of any other reason. Given that fact, my > answers/replies/comments may seem off the wall > > > The only hope for this situation is for Kay to continue to do her own > > thing and continue to submit a text copy for uploading to the appropriate > > county directory in the archives and for Linda to remove the Archives > > Census Project pages and to quit soliciting volunteers. The only other > > alternative is to ask for the resignation of both Kay and Linda. > > > > In other words, split the census project away from the Archives > project, and have it as a "stand alone" project? But I feel that if we > decide this that Linda will have no part of that decision. In turn if you > splinter the census project, will S-K Publications honor this split and > continue to send in the images in to be uploaded to the census > project? You have a lot to ponder on this, those images are a > "bonus" for researchers. > > Speaking of researchers, this is why the USGenWeb Project was > started, and I think any solution we come up with the researchers > need to be top priority in any decision. Personally I think we need to > make everyone aware they need to get rid of the *I* syndrome and > think about the "customers". The "customers" don't give a darn about > who is running what or even where it is stored, nor any of the inner > workings of this project -- all they care about is the ease of access. > > I see no reason why Linda could not just have a link to the > USGenWeb Archives Project (Kay's version) -- JMHO. > > I would probably say the same thing if the Tombstone or any other > project decides to have their own special place. It is specialized > research so why shouldn't it? > > > This demanding to remove files from each others directories is ludicrous > > and goes against the "free" use by the USGenWeb Project that is one of the > > founding principals of this project. It must be all for one and one for > > all or we are dead in the water, folks. > > > > It is ludicrous, I agree, with one demanding one thing and the other > one not demanding too much. Seems to me that Kay has taken care > of every obsticle or "demand" made (Holly's name is back on the > pages) and if the Kay's people are informing Linda's people of new > census online, if they want to copy them to their directory, what is > the problem? > > We talk about "poor" Rootsweb having double files on their server. It > is my humble opinion that if they were concerned over that they > would not have issued Kay another directory. I am sure if they > thought there was an inkling of a problem they would have asked > Linda about the "new" directory for the census project. That part is a > RW problem and not ours. > > > Are we going to allow Kay and Linda to tear this project apart or are we > > going to stop this now??? > > > > What both those folks are doing is showing their tails right now, and > if they want to do that -- it is fine by me. However, I don't think that > those two are capable of tearing the USGenWeb Project apart, if so > then both have too much influence for the good of the project. > > My solution was above, mixed in with my rhetoric. The Census > Project may have been Linda's "baby" but it is growing into it's own > and Linda should let loose of the apron strings. > > Bridgett > > Bridgett Smith > SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region > > bascs@wizard.com > > *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* > > TNGenWeb State Coordinator > http://www.tngenweb.org/ Well, Bridgett, you said much better with yours words than what mine tried to say. Bill -- ------=_NextPart_000_015E_01BF7D2F.378289E0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (23).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (23).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc07.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc07.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.42]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id GAA07402 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 06:58:21 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.67.146.130]) by mtiwmhc07.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990216125749.HJNC11074@worldnet.att.net>; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 12:57:49 +0000 Message-ID: <36C96B01.A04E5A83@worldnet.att.net> Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 07:56:34 -0500 From: William N Oliver Reply-To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net Organization: NEGenWeb/OHGenWeb/USGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,nl,de-CH,de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Ms. Piglet" CC: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs Subject: Re: Census Project References: <005a01be597a$0a926100$bb0a9cd1@william> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 5faf7540b16d03abf984b0e367ac73ff A Lot of talk about contracts here. What kind of contracts? Written, signed and all? Being a newbie, I'm unaware of any thing like this. If there was a contract with RW that would prohibit projects maturing and going it on their own, why isn't RW saying something in all this? How were contract made? Signed, sealed and delivered? Verbal? Moral? If there are any types of contracts between RW and USGWP, or its separate projects, why aren't they in the board archives? At least I was unable to find any. Also, Megan seems to understand what I meant by putting a "foot down". It is necessary to know our minds, as a "corporate body", and where we want to go with it. She took better time to express herself. And, please, folks, these are just questions to help me understand. Good decisions are only as good as the information known. Sincerely, Bill -- =======================> "Ms. Piglet" wrote: > I have said before that I have no particular problem with the census project > being separate from the archives. > > I *do* have a problem with the idea that Kay just decided one day that she > didn't want to be a part of the archives any more (and the census project > *was* a subdivision of the archives when she inherited it), and therefore > removed the project from the archives without the permission of the archives > coordinator, the board, or anyone else. > > I *also* have a problem with Linda's attitude that she will simply ignore > Kay and make a new census project in the archives. > > It appears to me that what started as a personal problem between the two > (whether or not Linda would be allowed to tell Kay what to do) has gone on > to become a major mess with a lot of people involved. > > Linda says that the archives (as opposed to the CP) have a contract with SK > concerning the images. I don't know if that's a verbal or written contract; > if a written contract, I don't know what it specifies. We may need to > follow up on that specifically. > > Linda also says that the archives have a contract with RootsWeb, and has > repeatedly given me to understand that in the unlikely event that the board > would direct that the archives be removed from RootsWeb, her response would > be to remove the archives from the Project and keep them at RW. Again, I > don't know the nature of this contract nor what it specifies. > > I mention this only as evidence that I think the problem goes deeper than > the surface---other than their personal conflicts, it appears to me that > both ladies deeply believe that when push comes to shove, the projects they > head are *theirs* to decide what to do with, and should the board direct > them to do other than what they want to do, the board will be ignored. > > I think we should be aware of this, because the odds are that if we direct > anything, we'll end up directing one or the other to do something she does > not wish to do. We should go into that having a clear view of what our next > move is if we are ignored or defied. > > I do *not* want us to go into a situation where we attempt to sort out the > problem, get ignored, and then say "oh, well, we tried.....you're right, we > have no power at all, and can't tell anybody what to do." That would do > inestimable damage to not only this board but all future boards. > > piglet (megan zurawicz) ICQ: 18429839 ====== signature file and original msg cut =====> ------=_NextPart_000_015E_01BF7D2F.378289E0-- [xxxxxxx] Tue Feb 22 13:21:54 2000 [xxxxxxx] Received: from mail1.radix.net (mail1.radix.net [207.192.128.31]) by saltmine.radix.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA14862 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:21:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from [xxxxxx] ([xxxxxx] [199.184.119.1]) by mail1.radix.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA21354 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:21:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (nei-pm2-018.inetnebr.com [206.222.223.92]) by [xxxxxx] (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA16489; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:21:40 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <016c01bf7d61$962d15a0$5cdfdece@default> [xxxxxxx] To: "merope" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:21:04 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0169_01BF7D2F.4B8B0480" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0169_01BF7D2F.4B8B0480 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------=_NextPart_000_0169_01BF7D2F.4B8B0480 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (24).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (24).eml" Return-Path: Received: from usunwired.net (mailserver.usunwired.net [208.215.35.11]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA05654 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 09:17:19 -0600 (CST) Received: from jcraven.iamerica.net [208.241.128.185] by usunwired.net (SMTPD32-4.07) id AAC01A9500C8; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 09:12:00 CDT Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19990216091829.00854b40@mail.usunwired.net> X-Sender: jcraven@mail.usunwired.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 09:18:29 -0700 To: Betsy Mills , wnoliver@worldnet.att.net From: Jan Craven Subject: Re: Census Project Cc: Bridgett Smith , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs References: <36C8ECDD.B1F62566@worldnet.att.net> <19990216032126.QJNI17975@mail.1starnet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: 65a0291fdfd54bc53f02ef5eb80eea28 I haven't finished reading all the mail, so take that into consideration when reading this. You will have MASS Histeria if you ask the archvies managers to remove all census data from their files. As the manager from Louisiana, I solicited census data from our state gen soc and rec. HUGE amounts of it. This was for the USGW ARCHIVES and not for either census project. I spent untold hours getting proper permission to have these online. If you tell me to remove all of these, I will be most upset. I think there are other state archive managers who can tell you similar stories. Jan. At 10:05 PM 2/15/1999 -0600, Betsy Mills wrote: >So, are you going to ask that all census transcriptions be removed from the >archives??? They have been uploaded to many of the county directories - >not to >a separate directory as Kay is doing now. Are you going to REMOVE all the >files that are in the archives???? I think not. So, you will continue to >have >two copies of the census files. Okay, so they are backed up. > >Exactly WHAT are you suggesting we put our foot down about then?? My solution >was to calm the waters, not make them worse. Kay has her project and the >archives receives a copy of the text file to upload to the archives in the >county directory. Linda removes her census pages that are only a table of >contents specific to the census and quits soliciting volunteers for HER census >project and continues as the archives manager. > >What is your solution?? > >Betsy > > > >At 10:58 PM 02/15/1999 -0500, William N Oliver wrote: >>Betsy and Board members, >> >>It seems that there is one more fire that must be dealt with. When will >we as >>Leadership get together as one and put a foot down?? I certainly agree with >>most of your points, plus what is below. >> >>My support is for the idea that there should be only one "Census Project". >>Further, my support goes for the USGW Census Project Manager/Coordinator, Kay >>Mason, to continue the project as she has been doing. >> >>It seems to me that as Kay Mason became the Census Project Manager, it is >hers >>to management and the Board should support that. Especially since there does >>not seem to be any restriction to the main goal of free access to >information. >> >>It seems that the CPM has listened to comments and made adjustments to pages >in >>copyright and credit where credit is due. Thus, what grounds is there to ask >>for a resignation? >> >>There was mention that no one could find the information because it was >not in >>with the "archives" and couldn't be searched. If I recall talk from RW, >search >>engines are in the making to handle any such problem. So, again what >problem?? >> >>Detail; if memory serves correctly, it was Ken Hollingsworth who turned the >>reins over to Kay. The most important point is simply that when projects >>become quite large, there is nothing wrong with separation. Like sending a >>child out when they mature. Certainly no one is saying Linda hasn't been a >>good manager of the archives. >> >>Finally, even if the AB asked for resignations from either or both Project >>managers, I read the BLs to say it can't be forced. Only their respective >>boards can do that. >> >>Sincerely, >> >>Bill >>-- >>==========================================> >> >>> Kay is NOT cc:ed on this message for obvious reasons. I ask that no board >>> member forward a copy of this to her either. >>> >>> Okay, do we now ask Linda's supporters to forward their complaints about >>> Kay to this list??? This has to stop and the board has to stop it. This >>> is threatening to split the archives and this whole project right down the >>> middle. >>> >>> The only hope for this situation is for Kay to continue to do her own thing >>> and continue to submit a text copy for uploading to the appropriate county >>> directory in the archives and for Linda to remove the Archives Census >>> Project pages and to quit soliciting volunteers. The only other >>> alternative is to ask for the resignation of both Kay and Linda. >>> >>> This demanding to remove files from each others directories is ludicrous >>> and goes against the "free" use by the USGenWeb Project that is one of the >>> founding principals of this project. It must be all for one and one for >>> all or we are dead in the water, folks. >>> >>> Are we going to allow Kay and Linda to tear this project apart or are we >>> going to stop this now??? >>> >>> Betsy >> > > ------=_NextPart_000_0169_01BF7D2F.4B8B0480 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (25).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (25).eml" Return-Path: Received: from usunwired.net (mailserver.usunwired.net [208.215.35.11]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA06269 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 09:19:49 -0600 (CST) Received: from jcraven.iamerica.net [208.241.128.185] by usunwired.net (SMTPD32-4.07) id AB69256200CE; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 09:14:49 CDT Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19990216092118.00804ba0@mail.usunwired.net> X-Sender: jcraven@mail.usunwired.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 09:21:18 -0700 To: "Lynn" , , "Betsy Mills" From: Jan Craven Subject: Re: Census Project Cc: "Bridgett Smith" , "Pam Reid" , "Yvonne James-Henderson" , "Celia Snyder" , "Beth Wills" , "Ginger Cisewski" , "Kim Harris-Myers" , "Trey Holt" , "Tim Stowell" , "Jim Powell" , "Megan Zurawicz" , "Bonnie McVicar-Briggs" In-Reply-To: <02af01be5962$f145c0a0$4bdfdece@default> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: 64854e3fc63978f79a52422284a49e42 Lynn and all. again, haven't read it all. The special projects were set up UNDER the archvies as special projects OF the archvies to have the files all in one place. That was the original plan and the plan that Kay agreed to when she took the job. Linda makes that very clear to all of us when we come onboard as an archvies volunteer. We are building ONE central digital library. Jan At 10:14 PM 2/15/1999 -0600, Lynn wrote: >Question: >I was under the impression that special projects were on one site, the >archives another. That info from the special projects site were all right >to copy into the archives if the submitter agreed. But ONLY if the >submitter agreed, and then they were no longer the submitters property. If >the submitter does NOT agree, then the archives does NOT copy to the >archives. >Am I off on a wild goose chase here? >Lynn > >-----Original Message----- >From: William N Oliver >To: Betsy Mills >Cc: Jan Craven ; Bridgett Smith >; Pam Reid ; Yvonne >James-Henderson ; Celia Snyder ; Beth Wills >; Ginger Cisewski ; Kim Harris-Myers >; Trey Holt ; Tim Stowell >; Jim Powell ; Megan >Zurawicz ; Lynn Watermann ; >Bonnie McVicar-Briggs >Date: Monday, February 15, 1999 9:59 PM >Subject: Re: Census Project > > >>Betsy and Board members, >> >>It seems that there is one more fire that must be dealt with. When will we >as >>Leadership get together as one and put a foot down?? I certainly agree >with >>most of your points, plus what is below. >> >>My support is for the idea that there should be only one "Census Project". >>Further, my support goes for the USGW Census Project Manager/Coordinator, >Kay >>Mason, to continue the project as she has been doing. >> >>It seems to me that as Kay Mason became the Census Project Manager, it is >hers >>to management and the Board should support that. Especially since there >does >>not seem to be any restriction to the main goal of free access to >information. >> >>It seems that the CPM has listened to comments and made adjustments to >pages in >>copyright and credit where credit is due. Thus, what grounds is there to >ask >>for a resignation? >> >>There was mention that no one could find the information because it was not >in >>with the "archives" and couldn't be searched. If I recall talk from RW, >search >>engines are in the making to handle any such problem. So, again what >problem?? >> >>Detail; if memory serves correctly, it was Ken Hollingsworth who turned the >>reins over to Kay. The most important point is simply that when projects >>become quite large, there is nothing wrong with separation. Like sending a >>child out when they mature. Certainly no one is saying Linda hasn't been a >>good manager of the archives. >> >>Finally, even if the AB asked for resignations from either or both Project >>managers, I read the BLs to say it can't be forced. Only their respective >>boards can do that. >> >>Sincerely, >> >>Bill >>-- >>==========================================> >> >>> Kay is NOT cc:ed on this message for obvious reasons. I ask that no >board >>> member forward a copy of this to her either. >>> >>> Okay, do we now ask Linda's supporters to forward their complaints about >>> Kay to this list??? This has to stop and the board has to stop it. This >>> is threatening to split the archives and this whole project right down >the >>> middle. >>> >>> The only hope for this situation is for Kay to continue to do her own >thing >>> and continue to submit a text copy for uploading to the appropriate >county >>> directory in the archives and for Linda to remove the Archives Census >>> Project pages and to quit soliciting volunteers. The only other >>> alternative is to ask for the resignation of both Kay and Linda. >>> >>> This demanding to remove files from each others directories is ludicrous >>> and goes against the "free" use by the USGenWeb Project that is one of >the >>> founding principals of this project. It must be all for one and one for >>> all or we are dead in the water, folks. >>> >>> Are we going to allow Kay and Linda to tear this project apart or are we >>> going to stop this now??? >>> >>> Betsy >> >> >> >> > > > ------=_NextPart_000_0169_01BF7D2F.4B8B0480 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (26).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (26).eml" Return-Path: Received: from usunwired.net (mailserver.usunwired.net [208.215.35.11]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA11980 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 09:40:25 -0600 (CST) Received: from jcraven.iamerica.net [208.241.128.185] by usunwired.net (SMTPD32-4.07) id A03722B300B4; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 09:35:19 CDT Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19990216094148.00879a80@mail.usunwired.net> X-Sender: jcraven@mail.usunwired.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 09:41:48 -0700 To: FEATHER2s@aol.com, betsym@1starnet.com, bascs@snark.wizard.com, pamreid@dc.jones.com, hen1@IDT.NET, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, bwills@ionia-mi.net, estral@switchboard.net, holt@txcyber.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, tstowell@mccallie.org, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net From: Jan Craven Subject: Re: Census Project In-Reply-To: <1b7ca347.36c9658e@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: eadeeca54de88ae5980c6fe7735651f1 Folks, you can remove me if you like. I would like to point out that it was my feeling that Kay was removed because she was personally involved, NOT because she was the census coord. Do what you like. Jan At 07:33 AM 2/16/1999 EST, FEATHER2s@aol.com wrote: >Good morning all, > >In typical AOL fashion, I stopped receiving email at about 9 p.m. last night, >and then when I logged on this morning at 5:30 my email "overfloweth." I'm >still trying to digest all this, so if I ramble, please forgive. > ><member forward a copy of this to her either.>> > >I think this is an excellent idea, but I also think we should remove the >Archives Rep from these discussions .. (Sorry, Jan. No offense intended!) >As a simple matter of "impartiality" it seems unfair for the Archives Rep to >be present while this is under discussion, especially when the Census Rep is >not... > >I admit I have had no experience with either the Archives or Census, but it >does seem that a project that was once quite small and struggling has now >become a large, busy and very productive "project within the project" and it >makes total sense to me to have removed that to a separate directory. I >expect (and hope) that other Special Projects will also outgrow the Archives >at some point and need to be separated, simply for convenience of the >volunteers working within them if nothing else. > >Trey's suggested statement was very well written, and I suggest that we come >to a consensus and issue a "formal statement" - Trey's or one similar - very >soon. > >If we delay action and wait for this to resolve itself it won't, and in the >meantime we are wasting and abusing our most valuable resource - our >volunteers! > >Ginger > > ------=_NextPart_000_0169_01BF7D2F.4B8B0480 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (27).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (27).eml" Return-Path: Received: from usunwired.net (mailserver.usunwired.net [208.215.35.11]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA13904 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 09:47:56 -0600 (CST) Received: from jcraven.iamerica.net [208.241.128.185] by usunwired.net (SMTPD32-4.07) id A202101100C0; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 09:42:58 CDT Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19990216094927.008575f0@mail.usunwired.net> X-Sender: jcraven@mail.usunwired.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 09:49:27 -0700 To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, "Ms. Piglet" From: Jan Craven Subject: Re: Census Project Cc: Bridgett Smith , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs In-Reply-To: <36C96B01.A04E5A83@worldnet.att.net> References: <005a01be597a$0a926100$bb0a9cd1@william> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: f7df037187f49dd07f22f3c9b8768988 This is what I know about the contract with Linda and Brian. When she started the Time to do Project, she needed a place to house the files. She went to several places and the only place that would give her unlimited space, access by volunteers to load files, and guarantee that they would always remain free was Rootsweb. She also had an agreement that the archvies would be the only digital library that Brian would house. Folks, I don't pretend to know ALL of the details of this, but this is the basics. Oh, this is a verbal agreement, but in the state of California, I understand that verbal contracts are upheld by the law. Hope this helps. Jan At 07:56 AM 2/16/1999 -0500, William N Oliver wrote: >A Lot of talk about contracts here. What kind of contracts? Written, signed >and all? > >Being a newbie, I'm unaware of any thing like this. > >If there was a contract with RW that would prohibit projects maturing and going >it on their own, why isn't RW saying something in all this? > >How were contract made? Signed, sealed and delivered? Verbal? Moral? > >If there are any types of contracts between RW and USGWP, or its separate >projects, why aren't they in the board archives? At least I was unable to find >any. > >Also, Megan seems to understand what I meant by putting a "foot down". It is >necessary to know our minds, as a "corporate body", and where we want to go with >it. She took better time to express herself. > >And, please, folks, these are just questions to help me understand. Good >decisions are only as good as the information known. > >Sincerely, > >Bill >-- >=======================> > >"Ms. Piglet" wrote: > >> I have said before that I have no particular problem with the census project >> being separate from the archives. >> >> I *do* have a problem with the idea that Kay just decided one day that she >> didn't want to be a part of the archives any more (and the census project >> *was* a subdivision of the archives when she inherited it), and therefore >> removed the project from the archives without the permission of the archives >> coordinator, the board, or anyone else. >> >> I *also* have a problem with Linda's attitude that she will simply ignore >> Kay and make a new census project in the archives. >> >> It appears to me that what started as a personal problem between the two >> (whether or not Linda would be allowed to tell Kay what to do) has gone on >> to become a major mess with a lot of people involved. >> >> Linda says that the archives (as opposed to the CP) have a contract with SK >> concerning the images. I don't know if that's a verbal or written contract; >> if a written contract, I don't know what it specifies. We may need to >> follow up on that specifically. >> >> Linda also says that the archives have a contract with RootsWeb, and has >> repeatedly given me to understand that in the unlikely event that the board >> would direct that the archives be removed from RootsWeb, her response would >> be to remove the archives from the Project and keep them at RW. Again, I >> don't know the nature of this contract nor what it specifies. >> >> I mention this only as evidence that I think the problem goes deeper than >> the surface---other than their personal conflicts, it appears to me that >> both ladies deeply believe that when push comes to shove, the projects they >> head are *theirs* to decide what to do with, and should the board direct >> them to do other than what they want to do, the board will be ignored. >> >> I think we should be aware of this, because the odds are that if we direct >> anything, we'll end up directing one or the other to do something she does >> not wish to do. We should go into that having a clear view of what our next >> move is if we are ignored or defied. >> >> I do *not* want us to go into a situation where we attempt to sort out the >> problem, get ignored, and then say "oh, well, we tried.....you're right, we >> have no power at all, and can't tell anybody what to do." That would do >> inestimable damage to not only this board but all future boards. >> >> piglet (megan zurawicz) ICQ: 18429839 > >====== signature file and original msg cut =====> > > > ------=_NextPart_000_0169_01BF7D2F.4B8B0480 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (28).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (28).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc07.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc07.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.42]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA01207 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 10:52:08 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.67.148.122]) by mtiwmhc07.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990216165135.CEVV5201@worldnet.att.net>; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 16:51:35 +0000 Message-ID: <36C9A1CC.91AC4BCD@worldnet.att.net> Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 11:50:21 -0500 From: William N Oliver Reply-To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net Organization: NEGenWeb/OHGenWeb/USGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,nl,de-CH,de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jan Craven CC: Lynn , Betsy Mills , Bridgett Smith , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs Subject: Re: Census Project References: <3.0.1.32.19990216092118.00804ba0@mail.usunwired.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 3deee3c2e3ee9c0b9349670e923f840a Good points Jan. My perspective comes in slightly different. It seems, to me, that as projects grow and mature they need not be governed by former, older structures. There is no way for sure that I know exactly what Kay agreed to until allowed to ask, however, it seems to me her tenure precedes the BLs and the BLs themselves did change the structure. I'm open to correction if wrong. Further, with Jim's idea of a good PR announcement coupled with Trey's suggested motion would certainly work providing the Board is willing to stand behind them. I'm not afraid at all of getting CC comments, etc, but the escalation of the Census Project issue seems to beg for an immediate calm, sane, forceful stand by the AB. Not demeaning to either side in any way. We, "at the top", need to find the way to set up goals that will allow growth to manifest and not bureaucratic anarchy and chaos. Defining domains between the two managers will help when other projects seek independence. What we do will set precedence, hopefully a good precedence. I've said this in other places ... but it sure can be said here also: every person has a talent and a contribution to make. My sense is that each person involved in the USGWP has the same goal -- free access to information. Sincerely, Bill -- ====================> Jan Craven wrote: > Lynn and all. > again, haven't read it all. > The special projects were set up UNDER the archvies as special projects OF the > archvies to have the files all in one place. That was the original plan > and the > plan that Kay agreed to when she took the job. > Linda makes that very clear to all of us when we come onboard as an archvies > volunteer. We are building ONE central digital library. Jan > At 10:14 PM 2/15/1999 -0600, Lynn wrote: > >Question: > >I was under the impression that special projects were on one site, the > >archives another. That info from the special projects site were all right > >to copy into the archives if the submitter agreed. But ONLY if the > >submitter agreed, and then they were no longer the submitters property. If > >the submitter does NOT agree, then the archives does NOT copy to the > >archives. > >Am I off on a wild goose chase here? > >Lynn > > > > ======= whew ... cut for brevity =============> ------=_NextPart_000_0169_01BF7D2F.4B8B0480 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (29).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (29).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc07.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc07.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.42]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA24817 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 12:27:29 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.67.148.135]) by mtiwmhc07.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990216182656.DHHL5201@worldnet.att.net>; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 18:26:56 +0000 Message-ID: <36C9B828.AF8E520@worldnet.att.net> Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 13:25:46 -0500 From: William N Oliver Reply-To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net Organization: NEGenWeb/OHGenWeb/USGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,nl,de-CH,de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jan Craven CC: Lynn , Betsy Mills , Bridgett Smith , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs Subject: Re: Census Project References: <3.0.1.32.19990216092118.00804ba0@mail.usunwired.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 6b32b1ccbdfe6e8114bba5312c8d997a FWIW: There is a sense that someone not from this board has been out there doing some commenting. My only real evidence for this is that outside our group mail is copied to me with my glasscity addy. I just went over there and I have quite a few posts. Any rate, this one interested me. Who is Melinda?? Her description [analogy] about the High and Low roads has been my perception. And, this person seems to be imploring the AB to do some firm, sane action. Sincerely, Bill -- Date sent: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 11:22:14 -0600 Subject: USGenWeb Board: Census Project Problem From: "Melinda Parmer" To: "Yvonne James-Henderson" , Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Ginger Cisewski , "Kim Harris-Myers" , Trey Holt , Waterman Lynn , Wills Beth , Betsy Mills , Kay Mason , "Celia G. Snyder" , Bill Oliver , ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Jim Powell , Ms Piglet , Tim Stowell , "Bonnie McVicar-Briggs" Dear Board Members, I am the Mac Tech on the Census Project. I really don't give a flip about any of the higher-ups political power trips, and neither do any of the volunteers I work with. I just check my email several times a day to see if anyone needs Mac assistance on the Census Project, and if they do, I give it to them as quickly as I can. When I have their census ready to go, I send it to Project Coordinators Kay Mason and Sue Soden and they post it. When there's a question, I pose it to Kay and Sue and they answer it. I've been working closely with Kay and Sue for months and see no reason for there to be a separate census project headed by Linda Lewis, whoever she is. Let us do our volunteer work the way we have been. The bottom line here is results. Kay and Sue are getting results and I don't even know who Linda Lewis is. She's probably a really great person, but she hasn't been working on the Census Project with me that I've been aware of. Now she has her own census project and she thinks I'm a volunteer there too? What's up with that? Letters keep popping up in the census mailing lists (and in newsgroups) that appear to be trying to tear the project apart. Several of us have regular lives and don't need to be sucked into whatever the argument is. I mean that several people will probably stop volunteering for the project rather than put up with all the ill will being spread about. I include myself in that "several people" group. If that IS the intention, let us know and we can all stop volunteering right now and not waste anymore time. By the way, "several people" are also wondering what is REALLY going on, and why the Board isn't addressing the issue. From our standpoint, the attacks seem to be coming from Ms. Lewis's camp, and Kay and Sue seem to be taking the high road and have just been trying to explain what they have been doing. Their explanations have been logical and reasonable, and it all makes Ms. Lewis look like she's gone off the deep end, frankly. If there is another side to this that is actually logical and reasonable, none of us know what it is. I have a suggested task list for the Board: (1) Decide which of the 2 Census Projects actually represents the USGenWeb project, and close down the other. Duplication of effort is a waste of time. (2) Post this decision to all the census mailing lists, letting all the volunteers know who is in charge of the Census Project. Thanks for your time. I know you are all volunteers just like me, and you have regular lives just like me, and for all I know you are just as confused about what is going on. However, you are in a position to do something about it, and all I can do is write this letter and ask you to do it. -- -- Melinda Parmer Houston, TX mparmer@io.com USGenWeb Census Project Mac Tech Parmer Genealogy: http://www.io.com/~mparmer/genweb/ Texas Gulf Coast Birding and Naturalist Web: http://www.io.com/~pdhulce/ Help me support HITS Unicorn Theatre online through igive.com http://www.igive.com/html/ssi.cfm?CID=1761&MID=8559 USGenWeb Census Project http://www.usgenweb.org/census/ http://www.usgenweb.com/census http://www.usgenweb.net/census/ Montgomery County Mississippi http://www.rootsweb.com/~msmontgo/ ------=_NextPart_000_0169_01BF7D2F.4B8B0480-- [xxxxxxx] Tue Feb 22 13:22:22 2000 [xxxxxxx] Received: from mail1.radix.net (mail1.radix.net [207.192.128.31]) by saltmine.radix.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA14894 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:22:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from [xxxxxx] ([xxxxxx] [199.184.119.1]) by mail1.radix.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA21439 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:22:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (nei-pm2-018.inetnebr.com [206.222.223.92]) by [xxxxxx] (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA16876; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:22:14 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <017701bf7d61$aa0c5d60$5cdfdece@default> [xxxxxxx] To: "merope" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:21:39 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0174_01BF7D2F.5F6A4C40" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0174_01BF7D2F.5F6A4C40 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------=_NextPart_000_0174_01BF7D2F.5F6A4C40 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (30).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (30).eml" Return-Path: Received: from u2.farm.idt.net (root@u2.farm.idt.net [169.132.8.11]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA26454 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 12:33:53 -0600 (CST) Received: from idt.net (ppp-58.ts-1.dc.idt.net [169.132.20.202]) by u2.farm.idt.net (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA05336; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 13:33:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <36C9BAD0.D62CF5C5@idt.net> Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 13:37:04 -0500 From: Yvonne James-Henderson Organization: Visit Daisy's Roots! http://www.rootsweb.com/~daisy/1daisy.htm X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net CC: Jan Craven , Lynn , Betsy Mills , Bridgett Smith , Pam Reid , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs Subject: Re: Census Project References: <3.0.1.32.19990216092118.00804ba0@mail.usunwired.net> <36C9B828.AF8E520@worldnet.att.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 27074a06f6634067e82540d9c9a94cab On the Census-L Discussion List, Sue Soden has been asking them all to write to the board and complain. Take care, Yvonne in Burke, VA Vive la USGenWeb Project! ************************** MOGenWeb State Coordinator and Archives Manager http://www.rootsweb.com/~mogenweb/mo.htm http://www.rootsweb.com/~usgenweb/mo/mofiles.htm KS Archives Manager http://www.rootsweb.com/~usgenweb/ks/ksfiles.htm DC Archives Manager http://www.rootsweb.com/~usgenweb/dc/dcfiles.htm KS, MO,DC and NC Tombstone Project Manager USGenWeb National Advisory Board SE/Mid-Atlantic ------=_NextPart_000_0174_01BF7D2F.5F6A4C40 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (31).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (31).eml" Return-Path: Received: from staff1.cso.uiuc.edu (root@staff1.cso.uiuc.edu [128.174.5.59]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA01239 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 12:54:13 -0600 (CST) Received: from [128.174.125.189] (gradoffmac1.me.uiuc.edu [128.174.125.189]) by staff1.cso.uiuc.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA20262; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 12:54:03 -0600 (CST) Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 12:54:03 -0600 (CST) X-Sender: cgsnyder@staff.uiuc.edu Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <36C9BAD0.D62CF5C5@idt.net> References: <3.0.1.32.19990216092118.00804ba0@mail.usunwired.net> <36C9B828.AF8E520@worldnet.att.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Yvonne James-Henderson From: "Celia G. Snyder" Subject: Re: Census Project Cc: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, Jan Craven , Lynn , Betsy Mills , Bridgett Smith , Pam Reid , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs X-UIDL: d466d6d5030788dfcc7397fb13eb290e Someone has given them the addys for this mail list as well, since I would not be included if they went to the national website to get the addys for the board members. Celia At 1:37 PM -0500 2/16/99, Yvonne James-Henderson wrote: >On the Census-L Discussion List, Sue Soden has been asking them all >to write to the board and complain. > > >Take care, >Yvonne in Burke, VA >Vive la USGenWeb Project! >************************** >MOGenWeb State Coordinator and Archives Manager >http://www.rootsweb.com/~mogenweb/mo.htm >http://www.rootsweb.com/~usgenweb/mo/mofiles.htm >KS Archives Manager >http://www.rootsweb.com/~usgenweb/ks/ksfiles.htm >DC Archives Manager >http://www.rootsweb.com/~usgenweb/dc/dcfiles.htm >KS, MO,DC and NC Tombstone Project Manager >USGenWeb National Advisory Board SE/Mid-Atlantic ------------------------------------------------------------------- Celia G. Snyder, Graduate Programs Coordinator (mailto:cgsnyder@uiuc.edu) Dept. of Mech. and Indus. Engr., University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign 140 Mechanical Engineering Building (MC-244), 1206 West Green Street, Urbana, IL 61801 UIUC WEB SITES RELATED TO GRADUATE SCHOOL: UIUC: http://www.uiuc.edu Mechanical and Industrial Engineering: http://www.mie.uiuc.edu Graduate College: http://www.grad.uiuc.edu M&IE Graduate Program Information: http://www.mie.uiuc.edu/academic-programs/graduate/grad.html Financial Aid: http://www.grad.uiuc.edu/financial_aid Off-Campus Housing: http://www.news-gazette.com/ ------=_NextPart_000_0174_01BF7D2F.5F6A4C40 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (32).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (32).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.39]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA04667 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 13:08:56 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.76.100.47]) by mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990216190825.GCGJ22890@worldnet.att.net>; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 19:08:25 +0000 Message-ID: <36C9C1E4.2B5B7788@worldnet.att.net> Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 14:07:16 -0500 From: William N Oliver Reply-To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net Organization: NEGenWeb/OHGenWeb/USGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,nl,de-CH,de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Celia G. Snyder" CC: Yvonne James-Henderson , Jan Craven , Lynn , Betsy Mills , Bridgett Smith , Pam Reid , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs Subject: Re: Census Project References: <3.0.1.32.19990216092118.00804ba0@mail.usunwired.net> <36C9B828.AF8E520@worldnet.att.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 55330491f148f65e77ac44cea8b3929b That may not be so in my case at any rate. Just checked. GlassCity is still the addy on the USGWP who's who page. In your case they may have wanted you in the "in". Bill -- "Celia G. Snyder" wrote: > Someone has given them the addys for this mail list as well, since I would > not be included if they went to the national website to get the addys for > the board members. > > Celia ========= snip ================> ------=_NextPart_000_0174_01BF7D2F.5F6A4C40 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (33).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (33).eml" Return-Path: Received: from jubjub.wizard.com (jubjub.wizard.com [199.171.28.9]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA13321 [xxxxxx] Thu, 18 Feb 1999 13:08:22 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (pm3-3-109.wizard.com [208.211.54.109]) by jubjub.wizard.com (8.9.2/8.9.0) with SMTP id LAA13647; Thu, 18 Feb 1999 11:15:06 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199902181915.LAA13647@jubjub.wizard.com> From: "Bridgett Smith" To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 11:07:14 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Census Project Priority: normal In-reply-to: <36CB9930.C4071404@worldnet.att.net> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) X-UIDL: 2a81031815eb919d89d17c122aa63261 I tend to disagree here. There are still 2 Census Projects. It seems to me that all we have done is to request the Census Project known as the Archives Census Project to not continue recruiting for their project, and to stop transcribing (?) (sorry folks I just reread the motion and just caught that portion of it). How would that effect the data coming in from S-K? Will this data be submitted to the USGW Census Project instead for transcribing? We basically haven't dissolved the Archives Census Project, as far as I can tell. Bridgett On 17 Feb 99, at 23:38, jpowelljr wrote: > My feeling is we have just aligned the present situation to > the Bylaws and common sense. Now we can proceed with any > grievances or complaints that deal with the system as it is > going to be. The Archives are still the Archives, The > Census Project is still the Census Project. Now that we > shouldn't have to deal with the two census projects, we > should be able to deal directly with any problems with the > one Census Project. Just my opinion of course. > > Jim > Bridgett Smith SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region bascs@wizard.com *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* TNGenWeb State Coordinator http://www.tngenweb.org/ ------=_NextPart_000_0174_01BF7D2F.5F6A4C40 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (5).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (5).eml" Return-Path: Received: from u2.farm.idt.net (root@u2.farm.idt.net [169.132.8.11]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA18209 [xxxxxx] Wed, 10 Feb 1999 07:58:03 -0600 (CST) Received: from idt.net (ppp-53.ts-1.dc.idt.net [169.132.20.197]) by u2.farm.idt.net (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA20038; Wed, 10 Feb 1999 08:57:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <36C1911F.99458A1@idt.net> Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 09:01:04 -0500 From: Yvonne James-Henderson Organization: Visit Daisy's Roots! http://www.rootsweb.com/~daisy/1daisy.htm X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jan Craven CC: kmfkm@ptw.com, Bridgett Smith , FEATHER2s@aol.com, estral@switchboard.net, holt@txcyber.com, "Waterman, Lynn*" , "Wills, Beth" , Betsy Mills , "Celia G. Snyder" , wnoliver@glasscity.com, jpowelljr , Ms Piglet , Tim Stowell Subject: Re: Census Project References: <36C0CB52.661D9AAF@idt.net> <3.0.1.32.19990210070048.00846c90@mail.usunwired.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: dd246205f38880e82a8795e887713214 Friends, I am sorry, but as a member of the USGenWeb AND the USGenWeb Archives Project, I still in the dark about this, myself. So, let me clarify a few of the points brought up earlier. Kay, when you said to me, "You know who your friends are". That hurt, this has nothing to do with friendship. I have always had very much respect for you, I don't want to have to choose between my friends. Why can't the two of you talk this out. I care about the USGenWeb project, that is why I am here, no other reason, if there are cracks internally, how in the world can we possibly keep it together on the outside. Linda recruited you to manage the Census Branch of the Archives, you have quietly moved all of the census files and left bad URLs through out the entire USGenWeb project. Linda has effectively been shut out of her own Census Project. That hurts the project. The purpose of the census project was to include the transcriptions in the "library" along with all the files and all future specialized Archives projects.. such as pensions, etc. The purpose is to have the files all in one spot... so they can be easily imported into any future technological computer systems... not scattered all over. If we separate the census files.. what's next? each state takes their files? > The census project started out as a branch of the original archives as did cemetery transcriptions. Wrong.. cemetery didn't start as a branch...... Pam did that separately and asked if she could upload the files to the Archives. Census started in the Archives, as part of the Archives... an Archives project. > When these topics became involved enough special > coordinators were assigned and they quickly became special projects of > their own. Just because data is coming from different special projects > doesnt mean it isnt a part of The USGenWeb Project Archives. > A coordinator (Kay) was recruited for the census by Linda.. as a part of the Archives. > If The USGenWeb Archives Project wants to duplicate what The USGenWeb > Census Project is doing or for that matter The USGenWeb Tombstone Project it seems to me that is a duplication of work and volunteer time. Funny.... the USGenWeb Census Project is duplicating the USGenWeb Archives Census Project....not the other way around. > I do think that if these projects choose to be in different directories the subject of the search engine probably needs to be coordinated so it is searching the entire "digital library". That's asking a lot of Rootsweb.. and not in keeping with the central repository idea from June 1996. Again, Kay, please.... you and Linda HAVE to talk about this! This is important to the USGenWeb's entire being. Take care, Yvonne in Burke, VA Vive la USGenWeb Project! ------=_NextPart_000_0174_01BF7D2F.5F6A4C40 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (6).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (6).eml" Return-Path: Received: from imo14.mx.aol.com (imo14.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.4]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA23371 [xxxxxx] Wed, 10 Feb 1999 16:14:07 -0600 (CST) From: FEATHER2s@aol.com Received: from FEATHER2s@aol.com by imo14.mx.aol.com (IMOv18.1) id GPDMa05506; Wed, 10 Feb 1999 17:01:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9b3eced3.36c201c5@aol.com> Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 17:01:41 EST To: bascs@snark.wizard.com, bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Census Project Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 205 X-UIDL: 4ef6b3455e74a6607701b337a306ef55 I agree with Bridgett! This is accomplishing nothing, and is definitely NOT in good taste! Ginger << It seems to me that Tim should appoint 2 people who can be as unbiased as possible on this and let them handle all the input, and come up with a resolution to this problem. Duking it out here on the list, especially with Kay sitting there reading everything is not in good taste, IMNSHO. Bridgett Bridgett Smith SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region bascs@wizard.com >> ------=_NextPart_000_0174_01BF7D2F.5F6A4C40-- [xxxxxxx] Tue Feb 22 13:22:57 2000 [xxxxxxx] Received: from mail1.radix.net (mail1.radix.net [207.192.128.31]) by saltmine.radix.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA14965 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:22:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from [xxxxxx] ([xxxxxx] [199.184.119.1]) by mail1.radix.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA21641 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:22:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (nei-pm2-018.inetnebr.com [206.222.223.92]) by [xxxxxx] (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA17144; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:22:47 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <018201bf7d61$bdc27240$5cdfdece@default> [xxxxxxx] To: "merope" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:22:12 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_017F_01BF7D2F.73280240" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_017F_01BF7D2F.73280240 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------=_NextPart_000_017F_01BF7D2F.73280240 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (7).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (7).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.networkone.net (root@mail.networkone.net [209.144.112.75]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA01025 [xxxxxx] Wed, 10 Feb 1999 16:42:33 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (assured-01-111.ln.networkone.net [209.144.118.112]) by mail.networkone.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id OAA26803; Wed, 10 Feb 1999 14:42:29 -0800 Message-Id: <199902102242.OAA26803@mail.networkone.net> From: "Kay Mason" To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, "Bridgett Smith" Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 14:35:25 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Census Project Reply-to: kmfkm@ptw.com Priority: normal In-reply-to: <199902102204.OAA03723@jubjub.wizard.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT X-UIDL: 3fb3c1b9dc1bb2f00253fad32b1281cf Thanks Bridgett, for showing some class.. Yes, it bothers me.. but, I would rather that you say whatever you have to say to my face than behind my back. We are forgetting again that USGW is about helping people with their genealogy. Getting information online, transcribing, doing lookups, etc.. Lets spend out time helping our volunteers do that, not fighting. Kay From: "Bridgett Smith" To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org Date sent: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 13:55:49 -0800 Subject: Census Project Priority: normal > It seems to me that Tim should appoint 2 people who can be as > unbiased as possible on this and let them handle all the input, and > come up with a resolution to this problem. > > Duking it out here on the list, especially with Kay sitting there > reading everything is not in good taste, IMNSHO. > > Bridgett > Bridgett Smith > SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region > > bascs@wizard.com > > *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* > > TNGenWeb State Coordinator > http://www.tngenweb.org/ > USGenWeb Census Project http://www.usgenweb.org/census/ http://www.usgenweb.com/census http://www.usgenweb.net/census/ Montgomery County Mississippi http://www.rootsweb.com/~msmontgo/ ------=_NextPart_000_017F_01BF7D2F.73280240 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (8).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (8).eml" Return-Path: Received: from s20.highertech.net (root@s20.highertech.net [209.54.120.20]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA09345 [xxxxxx] Wed, 10 Feb 1999 21:06:33 -0600 (CST) Received: from pizzard.chattanooga.net (tnt1-198.highertech.net [209.140.61.198]) by s20.highertech.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id WAA04942; Wed, 10 Feb 1999 22:05:44 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990210215621.008309c0@mail.mccallie.org> X-Sender: tstowell@mail.mccallie.org X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 21:56:21 -0500 To: "Bridgett Smith" , bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com From: Tim Stowell Subject: Re: Census Project In-Reply-To: <199902102204.OAA03723@jubjub.wizard.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: bef2159120033a08c91dd538c2234dc1 In response to, I believe it was Bill's suggestion, I've written both parties asking them to share their version of events with me. Of course if ya'll decide I should do this another way, please let me know. I'm trying to come to an understanding of all sides of this, much like Yvonne! From what I've heard so far - still want to get some facts - I've got a quasi idea forming. I was surprised that most of the Board was in the dark on this. Tim At 01:55 PM 2/10/99 -0800, Bridgett Smith wrote: >It seems to me that Tim should appoint 2 people who can be as >unbiased as possible on this and let them handle all the input, and >come up with a resolution to this problem. > >Duking it out here on the list, especially with Kay sitting there >reading everything is not in good taste, IMNSHO. > >Bridgett >Bridgett Smith >SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region > >bascs@wizard.com > >*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* > >TNGenWeb State Coordinator >http://www.tngenweb.org/ > > ------=_NextPart_000_017F_01BF7D2F.73280240 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census Project (9).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census Project (9).eml" Return-Path: Received: from imo29.mx.aol.com (imo29.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.73]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA05692 [xxxxxx] Thu, 11 Feb 1999 17:03:09 -0600 (CST) From: FEATHER2s@aol.com Received: from FEATHER2s@aol.com by imo29.mx.aol.com (IMOv18.1) id TLXRa11080; Thu, 11 Feb 1999 17:43:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <60b11873.36c35d13@aol.com> Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 17:43:31 EST To: tstowell@mccallie.org, bascs@snark.wizard.com, bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Census Project Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 205 X-UIDL: 8bba7da2ecd8c0d0f4c100f11a22ec84 << In response to, I believe it was Bill's suggestion, I've written both parties asking them to share their version of events with me. Of course if ya'll decide I should do this another way, please let me know. >> Tim, This is a difficult situation for all of of us to deal with. Since you left yourself open to suggestions, I offer the following thoughts: While I believe it's appropriate for you to contact both parties involved, I think we all need to be very careful that whatever is done is within the exact letter of our Bylaws. Any other method would bring continuing questions and discord and solve nothing. "ARTICLE VI: DUTIES/QUALIFICATIONS OF ADVISORY BOARD Section 1. The Advisory Board shall perform the duties prescribed by these Bylaws, and by accepted parliamentary procedures. Section 2. The National Coordinator is responsible for the day-to-day administration of The USGenWeb Project and serves as the public representative for the project. The National Coordinator shall preside at all meetings of the Advisory Board, serve as an ex officio member of all sub-committees, and maintain the national organizational mail lists (i.e., State Coordinators, Advisory Board, and any appropriate sub-lists). Section 3. The responsibilities of the Advisory Board shall include: addressing any problem issues as they arise, aiding the state projects upon request, overseeing elections, advising and mediating, if necessary, any grievances or appeals, and appointing a Webmaster to maintain the national website." It would seem from reading the above excerpt that the NC is not given the power to actually mediate disputes. That power is given only to the Board as a whole. JMO, Ginger ------=_NextPart_000_017F_01BF7D2F.73280240 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census ProjectS (again, sigh) (2).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census ProjectS (again, sigh) (2).eml" Return-Path: Received: from usunwired.net (mailserver.usunwired.net [208.215.35.11]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id SAA11252 [xxxxxx] Thu, 18 Feb 1999 18:15:40 -0600 (CST) Received: from jcraven.iamerica.net [208.241.128.204] by usunwired.net (SMTPD32-4.07) id AD0CF2700D4; Thu, 18 Feb 1999 18:15:08 CDT Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19990218181707.00859400@mail.usunwired.net> X-Sender: jcraven@mail.usunwired.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 18:17:07 -0700 To: kmfkm@ptw.com, bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com, "Bridgett Smith" From: Jan Craven Subject: Re: Census ProjectS (again, ::sigh::) In-Reply-To: <199902182152.NAA18820@mail.networkone.net> References: <199902182004.MAA22871@jubjub.wizard.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: fa0b1303789faf690baa3bde84d06189 Kay, I am talking about an 1860 census for a Louisiana Parish. I was plainly told that it was for the census project and that is where it would STAY. Now, you tell me where that person got the idea. This was several months ago, so the idea has been there for a while. On your pages. You took Holly's pages and put your name on them. Holly told me that. Jan At 01:49 PM 2/18/1999 -0800, Kay Mason wrote: >The USGenWeb Census Project is stressing to all of its >coordinators and transcribers that *all* transcriptions will be >uploaded/linked to *BOTH* of the USGenWeb Project Archive >Directories... the USGenWeb Archvies Project Directory, and the >USGenWeb Census Project Directory. > >If you are talking about the message sent to all of the Board >members last night by my Proofreader Coordinator, Larry Cooley, >asking that his web pages be removed.. he is talking about WEB >PAGES, not his transcriptions (and he has done several).. you can >find them at: > >http://www.rootsweb.com/~usgenweb/census/proof/ > >and they include a page with the names of his proofreader >volunteers! He did not give permission for them to be copied.. and >they have his copyright notice on them. I am sure that if you were >in his position you would want them deleted too! I know exactly >how he feels.. as if you will look at: > >http://www.rootsweb.com/~usgenweb/census/info/ > >You will find that they have copied our "information" pages.. which >were written by Sue Soden, Connie Burkett and I. I want them >deleted also. > >Thank you, > >Kay Mason > > > > > >From: "Bridgett Smith" >To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, > mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, > kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, > FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, > tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, > cityslic@ix.netcom.com >Date sent: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 11:56:12 -0800 >Subject: Census ProjectS (again, ::sigh::) >Priority: normal > >> I am very disturbed by the fact that apparently the archives file >> managers !AND! the transcribers with the USGW Census project >> are now at odds to some extent. >> >> It makes no sense to me to transcribe a census for the USGWC >> project and NOT allow it to be linked and/or copied to the USGW >> Archives. Isn't that what we stated in that motion, that this would be >> allowed and encouraged? >> >> I am NOT saying this is happening, but from what I have been >> reading that the Coordinators from each Project are not stressing >> this fact to the file managers/transcribers. In fact, *if* they are silent >> on this issue on their lists, then they need to tell their >> respective volunteers what is what. >> >> *IF* the transcribers from the USGWC project are not allowing >> linking and or copying of census to the archives area, as it seems to >> be the case from one transcriber, then in MNSHO we don't need >> folks like that around. This causes dissension in both projects and at >> this time, given what we've just been through, smoothing over >> feelings and such are needed more than dissension. >> >> Am I saying to get rid of this transcriber? NO I am not, what I am >> saying is that this transcriber needs to be told what is allowed and >> what isn't. If it is his copyrighted transcription that he will not allow >> linked or copied to the archives, it is my believe that it shouldn't be >> allowed elsewhere either. >> >> These two groups have got to learn to get along. They need to >> understand that one isn't trying to undermine the other, which is >> what I think both groups are thinking. The spirit of cooperation >> should be instilled in both groups. If not, then why not just get rid of >> the Cenus project altogether. >> >> Bridgett >> Bridgett Smith >> SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region >> >> bascs@wizard.com >> >> *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* >> >> TNGenWeb State Coordinator >> http://www.tngenweb.org/ >> > > >USGenWeb Census Project >http://www.usgenweb.org/census/ >http://www.usgenweb.com/census >http://www.usgenweb.net/census/ >Montgomery County Mississippi >http://www.rootsweb.com/~msmontgo/ > > ------=_NextPart_000_017F_01BF7D2F.73280240 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census ProjectS (again, sigh) (3).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census ProjectS (again, sigh) (3).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc05.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc05.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.40]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA11677 [xxxxxx] Thu, 18 Feb 1999 18:17:15 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.77.213.176]) by mtiwmhc05.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990219001644.CDTA10208@worldnet.att.net>; Fri, 19 Feb 1999 00:16:44 +0000 Message-ID: <36CCADAE.6A8DBF3B@worldnet.att.net> Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 19:17:50 -0500 From: jpowelljr X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bridgett Smith CC: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com Subject: Re: Census ProjectS (again, ::sigh::) References: <199902182004.MAA22871@jubjub.wizard.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: cd1029458c5bd3256c36cd973e07c3f6 I totally agree with Bridgett. If the Archives managers really believe there is a need to double store the censuses (and not just link to the new directory), then it should be stated by both coordinators that as long as submitters/transcribers are properly credited, that any submitted census will go to both places. The Coordinators should stress that we are one large project with many sub projects. I grudgingly, at first, sent info that I had transcribed to the Archives. Now everything I transcribe goes to the Archives and my County pages. Sort of like allies, I collect and share it on my level and they store it and share it on a larger level. I can not for the life of me see why anyone would object to having their work in more than one place, unless they are afraid of losing control of it. But then, I thought once you sent your data to the Archives, you could not request that it be taken down. The censuses that I have transcribed are in 3 places, the Archives, the Census Project and in HTML format with annotations on my county site. Bottom line on all of this... If it is part of USGenWeb, it is for the benefit of the online researcher. The Censuses aren't badges for the separate projects to wear, but tools for the researcher. We you transcribe it you are giving it to anyone for there own personal use. Why are you worried which server it is on, or how many places it can be freely accessed? Jim Bridgett Smith wrote: > I am very disturbed by the fact that apparently the archives file > managers !AND! the transcribers with the USGW Census project > are now at odds to some extent. > > It makes no sense to me to transcribe a census for the USGWC > project and NOT allow it to be linked and/or copied to the USGW > Archives. Isn't that what we stated in that motion, that this would be > allowed and encouraged? > > I am NOT saying this is happening, but from what I have been > reading that the Coordinators from each Project are not stressing > this fact to the file managers/transcribers. In fact, *if* they are silent > on this issue on their lists, then they need to tell their > respective volunteers what is what. > > *IF* the transcribers from the USGWC project are not allowing > linking and or copying of census to the archives area, as it seems to > be the case from one transcriber, then in MNSHO we don't need > folks like that around. This causes dissension in both projects and at > this time, given what we've just been through, smoothing over > feelings and such are needed more than dissension. > > Am I saying to get rid of this transcriber? NO I am not, what I am > saying is that this transcriber needs to be told what is allowed and > what isn't. If it is his copyrighted transcription that he will not allow > linked or copied to the archives, it is my believe that it shouldn't be > allowed elsewhere either. > > These two groups have got to learn to get along. They need to > understand that one isn't trying to undermine the other, which is > what I think both groups are thinking. The spirit of cooperation > should be instilled in both groups. If not, then why not just get rid of > the Cenus project altogether. > > Bridgett > Bridgett Smith > SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region > > bascs@wizard.com > > *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* > > TNGenWeb State Coordinator > http://www.tngenweb.org/ -- Jim and Debbie Powell Family History Surname Connections Kentucky..POWELL..MADISON..CLAYTON..WINSTEAD..BOURLAND..HIBBS UTLEY..EARLE..BUNTIN..MOORE..WILLIAMS..TAPP..WICKLIFFE North Carolina/South Carolina..WATKINS..GADDY..NORWOOD..CROUCH REYNOLDS..BOYD..McGEE..WHITTLE..MADISON..CLAYTON WINSTEAD..BOURLAND..TAPP..FOWLER Virginia..OWEN New York/New Jersey..McCLELLAN..LaPAGE Georgia/Florida..HARRIS..HODGE..FOWLER Email: Jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net Family Homepage: Http://www.afn.org/~afn03098/ For slower connections: Http://www.afn.org/~afn04266/ Coordinator of Henderson County KyGenweb Page Http://www.rootsweb.com/~kyhender/ Coordinator of Gilchrist County FLGenWeb Page Http://www.rootsweb.com/~flgilchr/ Coordinator of Alachua County FLGenWeb Page Http://www.rootsweb.com/~flalachu/ Assistant State Coordinator FLGenWeb ------=_NextPart_000_017F_01BF7D2F.73280240 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census ProjectS (again, sigh) (4).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census ProjectS (again, sigh) (4).eml" Return-Path: Received: from jubjub.wizard.com (jubjub.wizard.com [199.171.28.9]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA16922 [xxxxxx] Thu, 18 Feb 1999 18:37:12 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (pm2-1-066.wizard.com [208.211.48.66]) by jubjub.wizard.com (8.9.2/8.9.0) with SMTP id QAA04096; Thu, 18 Feb 1999 16:43:56 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199902190043.QAA04096@jubjub.wizard.com> From: "Bridgett Smith" To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 16:36:00 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Census ProjectS (again, ::sigh::) Priority: normal In-reply-to: <3.0.1.32.19990218181707.00859400@mail.usunwired.net> References: <199902182152.NAA18820@mail.networkone.net> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) X-UIDL: bd367dd55d6d3ae8795ef9d1f94eaac1 Maybe I should stay out of this discussion, however, I'm not . I know nothing about the situation regarding a LA Parish transcription. So will not comment. However, I have been to the pages at USGW Census Project and Kay has put Holly's name back on those pages along with her own. She has given Holly credit. This may not have been true a week or two ago, I dunno -- but it is there now. Bridgett On 18 Feb 99, at 18:17, Jan Craven wrote: > Kay, > I am talking about an 1860 census for a Louisiana Parish. > I was plainly told that it was for the census project and that is > where it would STAY. Now, you tell me where that person > got the idea. This was several months ago, so the idea has > been there for a while. > > On your pages. > You took Holly's pages and put your name on them. > Holly told me that. > Jan Bridgett Smith SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region bascs@wizard.com *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* TNGenWeb State Coordinator http://www.tngenweb.org/ ------=_NextPart_000_017F_01BF7D2F.73280240-- [xxxxxxx] Tue Feb 22 13:23:34 2000 [xxxxxxx] Received: from mail1.radix.net (mail1.radix.net [207.192.128.31]) by saltmine.radix.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA15064 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:23:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from [xxxxxx] ([xxxxxx] [199.184.119.1]) by mail1.radix.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA21754 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:23:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (nei-pm2-018.inetnebr.com [206.222.223.92]) by [xxxxxx] (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA17366; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:23:19 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <018d01bf7d61$d0a5f4e0$5cdfdece@default> [xxxxxxx] To: "merope" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:22:43 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_018A_01BF7D2F.860B84E0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_018A_01BF7D2F.860B84E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------=_NextPart_000_018A_01BF7D2F.860B84E0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census ProjectS (again, sigh) (5).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census ProjectS (again, sigh) (5).eml" Return-Path: Received: from usunwired.net (mailserver.usunwired.net [208.215.35.11]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id UAA18116 [xxxxxx] Thu, 18 Feb 1999 20:35:51 -0600 (CST) Received: from jcraven.iamerica.net [208.241.128.204] by usunwired.net (SMTPD32-4.07) id ADE8C1300B2; Thu, 18 Feb 1999 20:35:20 CDT Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19990218203719.008738f0@mail.usunwired.net> X-Sender: jcraven@mail.usunwired.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 20:37:19 -0700 To: jpowelljr , Bridgett Smith From: Jan Craven Subject: Re: Census ProjectS (again, ::sigh::) Cc: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@glasscity.com, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com In-Reply-To: <36CCADAE.6A8DBF3B@worldnet.att.net> References: <199902182004.MAA22871@jubjub.wizard.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: 79ce3ca2f2b224a6b937c3a830a9c7f7 Jim. I think that all (or most) of the archvies managers feel like it is important to keep the archives files all in one place. I think that was shown when Kansas split off. This is no different. I personally don't care if Kay puts the census files in 50 different places as long as there is still a copy in the archvies. THAT IS MY PERSONAL OPINION. You are correct. The guidelines state that once it is in the arcvhies, it cannot be removed. I am just about to the point that Bridgett is. Eleminate both projects! Jan At 07:17 PM 2/18/1999 -0500, jpowelljr wrote: >I totally agree with Bridgett. If the Archives managers >really >believe there is a need to double store the censuses (and >not just link to the new directory), then it should be >stated by both coordinators that as long as >submitters/transcribers are properly credited, that any >submitted census will go to both places. The Coordinators >should stress that we are one large project with many sub >projects. I grudgingly, at first, sent info that I had >transcribed to the Archives. Now everything I transcribe >goes to the Archives and my County pages. Sort of like >allies, I >collect and share it on my level and they store it and share >it on a larger level. I can not for the life of me see why >anyone would object to having their work in more than one >place, unless they are afraid of losing control of it. But >then, I thought once you sent your data to the Archives, you >could not request that it be taken down. >The censuses that I have transcribed are in 3 places, the >Archives, the Census Project and in HTML format with >annotations on my county site. > >Bottom line on all of this... If it is part of USGenWeb, it >is for the benefit of the online researcher. The Censuses >aren't badges for the separate projects to wear, but tools >for the researcher. We you transcribe it you are giving it >to anyone for there own personal use. Why are you worried >which server it is on, or how many places it can be freely >accessed? > >Jim > >Bridgett Smith wrote: >> I am very disturbed by the fact that apparently the archives file >> managers !AND! the transcribers with the USGW Census project >> are now at odds to some extent. >> >> It makes no sense to me to transcribe a census for the USGWC >> project and NOT allow it to be linked and/or copied to the USGW >> Archives. Isn't that what we stated in that motion, that this would be >> allowed and encouraged? >> >> I am NOT saying this is happening, but from what I have been >> reading that the Coordinators from each Project are not stressing >> this fact to the file managers/transcribers. In fact, *if* they are silent >> on this issue on their lists, then they need to tell their >> respective volunteers what is what. >> >> *IF* the transcribers from the USGWC project are not allowing >> linking and or copying of census to the archives area, as it seems to >> be the case from one transcriber, then in MNSHO we don't need >> folks like that around. This causes dissension in both projects and at >> this time, given what we've just been through, smoothing over >> feelings and such are needed more than dissension. >> >> Am I saying to get rid of this transcriber? NO I am not, what I am >> saying is that this transcriber needs to be told what is allowed and >> what isn't. If it is his copyrighted transcription that he will not allow >> linked or copied to the archives, it is my believe that it shouldn't be >> allowed elsewhere either. >> >> These two groups have got to learn to get along. They need to >> understand that one isn't trying to undermine the other, which is >> what I think both groups are thinking. The spirit of cooperation >> should be instilled in both groups. If not, then why not just get rid of >> the Cenus project altogether. >> >> Bridgett >> Bridgett Smith >> SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region >> >> bascs@wizard.com >> >> *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* >> >> TNGenWeb State Coordinator >> http://www.tngenweb.org/ > >-- > Jim and Debbie Powell > Family History Surname Connections >Kentucky..POWELL..MADISON..CLAYTON..WINSTEAD..BOURLAND..HIBBS > >UTLEY..EARLE..BUNTIN..MOORE..WILLIAMS..TAPP..WICKLIFFE >North Carolina/South >Carolina..WATKINS..GADDY..NORWOOD..CROUCH > REYNOLDS..BOYD..McGEE..WHITTLE..MADISON..CLAYTON > WINSTEAD..BOURLAND..TAPP..FOWLER >Virginia..OWEN New York/New Jersey..McCLELLAN..LaPAGE >Georgia/Florida..HARRIS..HODGE..FOWLER > Email: Jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net > Family Homepage: Http://www.afn.org/~afn03098/ >For slower connections: Http://www.afn.org/~afn04266/ >Coordinator of Henderson County KyGenweb Page > Http://www.rootsweb.com/~kyhender/ >Coordinator of Gilchrist County FLGenWeb Page > Http://www.rootsweb.com/~flgilchr/ >Coordinator of Alachua County FLGenWeb Page > Http://www.rootsweb.com/~flalachu/ >Assistant State Coordinator FLGenWeb > > ------=_NextPart_000_018A_01BF7D2F.860B84E0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Census ProjectS (again, sigh).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Census ProjectS (again, sigh).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.networkone.net (root@mail.networkone.net [209.144.112.75]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA27617 [xxxxxx] Thu, 18 Feb 1999 15:52:12 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (assured-01-194.ln.networkone.net [209.144.118.195]) by mail.networkone.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id NAA18820; Thu, 18 Feb 1999 13:52:09 -0800 Message-Id: <199902182152.NAA18820@mail.networkone.net> From: "Kay Mason" To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com, "Bridgett Smith" Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 13:49:41 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Census ProjectS (again, ::sigh::) Reply-to: kmfkm@ptw.com Priority: normal In-reply-to: <199902182004.MAA22871@jubjub.wizard.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT X-UIDL: 71278ebb06336580c713846d35381350 The USGenWeb Census Project is stressing to all of its coordinators and transcribers that *all* transcriptions will be uploaded/linked to *BOTH* of the USGenWeb Project Archive Directories... the USGenWeb Archvies Project Directory, and the USGenWeb Census Project Directory. If you are talking about the message sent to all of the Board members last night by my Proofreader Coordinator, Larry Cooley, asking that his web pages be removed.. he is talking about WEB PAGES, not his transcriptions (and he has done several).. you can find them at: http://www.rootsweb.com/~usgenweb/census/proof/ and they include a page with the names of his proofreader volunteers! He did not give permission for them to be copied.. and they have his copyright notice on them. I am sure that if you were in his position you would want them deleted too! I know exactly how he feels.. as if you will look at: http://www.rootsweb.com/~usgenweb/census/info/ You will find that they have copied our "information" pages.. which were written by Sue Soden, Connie Burkett and I. I want them deleted also. Thank you, Kay Mason From: "Bridgett Smith" To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com Date sent: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 11:56:12 -0800 Subject: Census ProjectS (again, ::sigh::) Priority: normal > I am very disturbed by the fact that apparently the archives file > managers !AND! the transcribers with the USGW Census project > are now at odds to some extent. > > It makes no sense to me to transcribe a census for the USGWC > project and NOT allow it to be linked and/or copied to the USGW > Archives. Isn't that what we stated in that motion, that this would be > allowed and encouraged? > > I am NOT saying this is happening, but from what I have been > reading that the Coordinators from each Project are not stressing > this fact to the file managers/transcribers. In fact, *if* they are silent > on this issue on their lists, then they need to tell their > respective volunteers what is what. > > *IF* the transcribers from the USGWC project are not allowing > linking and or copying of census to the archives area, as it seems to > be the case from one transcriber, then in MNSHO we don't need > folks like that around. This causes dissension in both projects and at > this time, given what we've just been through, smoothing over > feelings and such are needed more than dissension. > > Am I saying to get rid of this transcriber? NO I am not, what I am > saying is that this transcriber needs to be told what is allowed and > what isn't. If it is his copyrighted transcription that he will not allow > linked or copied to the archives, it is my believe that it shouldn't be > allowed elsewhere either. > > These two groups have got to learn to get along. They need to > understand that one isn't trying to undermine the other, which is > what I think both groups are thinking. The spirit of cooperation > should be instilled in both groups. If not, then why not just get rid of > the Cenus project altogether. > > Bridgett > Bridgett Smith > SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region > > bascs@wizard.com > > *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* > > TNGenWeb State Coordinator > http://www.tngenweb.org/ > USGenWeb Census Project http://www.usgenweb.org/census/ http://www.usgenweb.com/census http://www.usgenweb.net/census/ Montgomery County Mississippi http://www.rootsweb.com/~msmontgo/ ------=_NextPart_000_018A_01BF7D2F.860B84E0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Closing of Board-L(2).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Closing of Board-L(2).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.1starnet.com (1starnet.com [207.243.104.17]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id UAA21364 [xxxxxx] Thu, 18 Feb 1999 20:46:47 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199902190246.UAA21364@[xxxxxx]> Received: from betsy [207.243.104.64] by mail.1starnet.com (SMTPD32-4.06) id A07FAED010C; Thu, 18 Feb 1999 20:46:23 CST X-Sender: betsym@1starnet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0.1 Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 20:42:41 -0600 To: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Kay Mason , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Bill Oliver , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , Linda Russell Lewis From: Betsy Mills Subject: Re: Closing of Board-L(?) In-Reply-To: <36CCBA8D.DFFEC1CD@worldnet.att.net> References: <00fd01be5b88$3ec60fc0$680c9cd1@william> <199902190105.RAA05888@jubjub.wizard.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: 3eb7e800274c171898166e252d1f26a4 Jim, please consider this. Do you ever go to your genealogical society meetings and visit outside the door with other members of the board? Do you ever call the other members on the telephone and talk about what happened at a meeting or what is going to happen at a meeting? Do you ever lean over and whisper a comment to a friend sitting next to you during a meeting? Do you share jokes with other members of the board? OR Do you only speak to them formally during a meeting, watching every word that is being said and never speak to them outside of a meeting? If you answered "yes" to any of the first questions, you are doing what we are doing on this cc: list. This does not mean we are holding clandestine meetings. If you really think that then take me off the cc: list. Minutes of a meeting would allow us to put our best face forward, to come out of a disagreeable situation with a smile of agreement on our faces. You don't have to report the "uh-ohs" of parliamentary procedure as was done on the board-l list yesterday. We will look a whole lot more organized and a whole lot less like idiots if we were to have minutes instead of a blow by blow that is saved forever. If I make a faux pas at a board meeting, my fellow officers can laugh with me and forget it. If we were to use the board-l for our only means of communication, my words are recorded "forever" for the world to laugh "at" me. Bridgett, if we can't stand allowing every cc: who wants to post a comment on a GenConnect board, then we can't stand for the board-l to be open and to "meet" only on that board. What is the difference between being allowed to "speak" one time (I don't think they should be allowed more than one post per subject, by the way) on a GenConnect board or to rant and rave on the lists? At least they would know that their idea or concern was heard. Obviously abusive or vulgar comments would be removed immediately. I would even offer to "oversee" such a board, but I will not offer to be the secretary as it stands now. Many of the tasks that are listed as tasks for the secretary are things that the NC could easily do. There seems to be little else that the NC is allowed to do! Just my thoughts! Betsy At 08:12 PM 02/18/1999 -0500, you wrote: >I will have to go along with the majority... but until my >dying day I will argue that we should be totally open to the >people that elected us. I can not properly represent people >who don't know what I am doing. I don't even know what I >can say or questions that I can ask outside of this "closed" >situation. I want to be upfront with the people who elected >me. I need an answer as to what I can take from here and >present to those Volunteers that I represent so that I may >accurately represent them. Closing of Board-L is pure >folly. These clandestine meetings aren't far behind. May I >ask the SE/MA list what think of the idea? > >If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen... >Shutting the door won't help.... Excuse me, but I must vent >a little, > >Jim > ------=_NextPart_000_018A_01BF7D2F.860B84E0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Closing of Board-L(3).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Closing of Board-L(3).eml" Return-Path: Received: from usunwired.net (mailserver.usunwired.net [208.215.35.11]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id UAA21785 [xxxxxx] Thu, 18 Feb 1999 20:48:22 -0600 (CST) Received: from jcraven.iamerica.net [208.241.128.204] by usunwired.net (SMTPD32-4.07) id A0D5197000BC; Thu, 18 Feb 1999 20:47:49 CDT Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19990218204948.008748b0@mail.usunwired.net> X-Sender: jcraven@mail.usunwired.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 20:49:48 -0700 To: jpowelljr , Bridgett Smith From: Jan Craven Subject: Re: Closing of Board-L(?) Cc: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com In-Reply-To: <36CCBA8D.DFFEC1CD@worldnet.att.net> References: <00fd01be5b88$3ec60fc0$680c9cd1@william> <199902190105.RAA05888@jubjub.wizard.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: 967e68a1ceb95bed5ba8593661707f7d Jim, the reason all of us are so careful about what we say is that one of our former board members took what was said to all kinds of list that they had no business doing. It was an extreme case, but it had to be stopped. This person was not being factual and was slanting the things they were saying and taking them out of context, etc, etc. I would like to have some new discussions on what we can take to the troups too. I think we'd all be more effectual if we felt like we could talk to them frankly about things that are happening. I don't think I splained this very well, maybe one of you other old bd members could add to this. I think it had something to do with the bylaws being passed and there being a board here to begin with. Some folks didn't like that fact and have determined to do everything they can to trash anything and everyone connected with that. I am sure that merope will have fun with that little statement! I don't read her anyway! Jan At 08:12 PM 2/18/1999 -0500, jpowelljr wrote: >I will have to go along with the majority... but until my >dying day I will argue that we should be totally open to the >people that elected us. I can not properly represent people >who don't know what I am doing. I don't even know what I >can say or questions that I can ask outside of this "closed" >situation. I want to be upfront with the people who elected >me. I need an answer as to what I can take from here and >present to those Volunteers that I represent so that I may >accurately represent them. Closing of Board-L is pure >folly. These clandestine meetings aren't far behind. May I >ask the SE/MA list what think of the idea? > >If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen... >Shutting the door won't help.... Excuse me, but I must vent >a little, > >Jim > > ------=_NextPart_000_018A_01BF7D2F.860B84E0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Closing of Board-L(4).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Closing of Board-L(4).eml" Return-Path: Received: from pimout1-int.prodigy.net (pimout1-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.58.53]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA26448 [xxxxxx] Thu, 18 Feb 1999 21:05:35 -0600 (CST) Received: from william (CHCGB209-09.splitrock.net [209.156.13.78]) by pimout1-int.prodigy.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA27784; Thu, 18 Feb 1999 22:03:55 -0500 Message-ID: <029501be5bb3$e6b137c0$680c9cd1@william> From: "Ms. Piglet" To: "jpowelljr" , "Bridgett Smith" Cc: , , , , , , , , , , , , , Subject: Re: Closing of Board-L(?) Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 20:59:37 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-UIDL: 8e7fa26a8083ed003df3f03cd35c3fad Jim....here's my idea on this: If we publish minutes, then in no way are we "hiding what we are doing." However, we've clearly had a problem in the last six months or so with folks like merope, who joys in going to the list archives to make a *big deal* about who said exactly what, and exactly how they phrased it, and what they must have secretly meant by that.... I don't know if you've ever served on a non-virtual board of directors. I have (local gensoc). Their board meetings would be just as stilted and non-functional as ours if somebody there was either audio or videotaping the meeting.....opening the possibility that somebody who isn't even a member of the society now may decide five years from now to take umbrage on the look on Paula's face when a particular person is mentioned. Having an archived board list and actually doing our business on that list (which *is* what it's for, and where we're supposed to be) puts us in essentially an identical situation. Yes, it is cc business what we are discussing, and what we do about it. But I truly do not see how it is cc business exactly who made what comment about it, how they phrased it.....and that is the ammunition that merope and her ilk have used to drive person after person off this board, hounding them about stuff like that. It's possible to be open about our actual business without having to provide fuel for petty disruptors. piglet (megan zurawicz) ICQ: 18429839 note: was pigolit@ix.netcom.com, now mspiglet@prodigy.net genealogy-- http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~piglet quilting-- http://pages.prodigy.net/mspiglet theatre-- http://members.aol.com/tupacratz/poohpix.htm -----Original Message----- From: jpowelljr To: Bridgett Smith Cc: bwills@ionia-mi.net ; cgsnyder@uiuc.edu ; hen1@idt.net ; holt@txcyber.com ; mspiglet@prodigy.net ; cestus3@inetnebr.com ; estral@switchboard.net ; kmfkm@ptw.com ; jcraven@usunwired.net ; FEATHER2s@aol.com ; wnoliver@worldnet.att.net ; betsym@1starnet.com ; tstowell@mccallie.org ; mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net ; cityslic@ix.netcom.com Date: Thursday, 18 February, 1999 19:09 Subject: Re: Closing of Board-L(?) >I will have to go along with the majority... but until my >dying day I will argue that we should be totally open to the >people that elected us. I can not properly represent people >who don't know what I am doing. I don't even know what I >can say or questions that I can ask outside of this "closed" >situation. I want to be upfront with the people who elected >me. I need an answer as to what I can take from here and >present to those Volunteers that I represent so that I may >accurately represent them. Closing of Board-L is pure >folly. These clandestine meetings aren't far behind. May I >ask the SE/MA list what think of the idea? > >If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen... >Shutting the door won't help.... Excuse me, but I must vent >a little, > >Jim ------=_NextPart_000_018A_01BF7D2F.860B84E0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Closing of Board-L(5).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Closing of Board-L(5).eml" Return-Path: Received: from jubjub.wizard.com (jubjub.wizard.com [199.171.28.9]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA05094 [xxxxxx] Thu, 18 Feb 1999 23:51:24 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (pm3-3-088.wizard.com [208.211.54.88]) by jubjub.wizard.com (8.9.2/8.9.0) with SMTP id VAA01671; Thu, 18 Feb 1999 21:58:19 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199902190558.VAA01671@jubjub.wizard.com> From: "Bridgett Smith" To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 21:50:21 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Closing of Board-L(?) Priority: normal In-reply-to: <199902190247.SAA06287@snark.wizard.com> References: <36CCBA8D.DFFEC1CD@worldnet.att.net> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) X-UIDL: 02e47e62af3e32f7c39589040c5c4215 On 18 Feb 99, at 20:42, Betsy Mills wrote: > > Bridgett, if we can't stand allowing every cc: who wants to post a comment > on a GenConnect board, then we can't stand for the board-l to be open and > to "meet" only on that board. What is the difference between being > allowed to "speak" one time (I don't think they should be allowed more > than one post per subject, by the way) on a GenConnect board or to rant > and rave on the lists? At least they would know that their idea or > concern was heard. Obviously abusive or vulgar comments would be removed > immediately. I would even offer to "oversee" such a board, but I will not > offer to be the secretary as it stands now. Betsy, You know me I have a very bad habit of saying something, and maybe not completely stating my whole thoughts all at one time The GenConnect board is a good idea. I suggest "read only" as no one is around 24 hours a day to be able to check on it it make sure that what a cc will post is in good taste, whether it be language and/or appropriate, in order to remove it. Then we come to removing a post by a cc, now don't you think that if we remove a post made by a CC that we would be accused of stifling that cc's freedom of speach?? No matter if it might be at the top of the page "Posts that are inappropriate in taste whether language and/or content will be removed without prior notice," we will still be accused of something. I propose that if a GenConnect type board is used, that a link to the USGW page with the board member's addys on them be a link with a suggestion that if you would like to make comment on any items to contact your representative. I will say this tho, that the SE/MA region has a regional board and the activity on that board is next to nothing. It's been announced on the mailing list that it there, I believe it was even put on the -ALL list when it first went up, it's on messages sent to the SE/MA mailing list as a footnote, so at least our region does have an area where they can post their concerns and it stands idle. I don't know what else that we, as the SE/MA representatives, can do. It seems that the cc's as a whole are like the many visitors who visit our respective county sites. The board receives more complaints on how they are doing business than compliments. In other words, if the cc's are happy with the status quo they are silent, however, if not you will know about it Personally, I feel that even if we close down the Board-L list, have a read only type of GenConnect Board to post minutes to, and keep our region informed via the mailing lists, and let them know that our "door" (email) is open to comments -- that we are NOT shutting the cc's out. As long as we keep them informed is what the major issue should be. Bridgett Bridgett Smith SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region bascs@wizard.com *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* TNGenWeb State Coordinator http://www.tngenweb.org/ ------=_NextPart_000_018A_01BF7D2F.860B84E0-- [xxxxxxx] Tue Feb 22 13:24:28 2000 [xxxxxxx] Received: from mail1.radix.net (mail1.radix.net [207.192.128.31]) by saltmine.radix.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA15141 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:24:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from [xxxxxx] ([xxxxxx] [199.184.119.1]) by mail1.radix.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA21931 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:24:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (nei-pm2-018.inetnebr.com [206.222.223.92]) by [xxxxxx] (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA17869; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:24:20 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <01a201bf7d61$f51ecf40$5cdfdece@default> [xxxxxxx] To: "merope" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:23:44 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_019F_01BF7D2F.AA7B3780" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_019F_01BF7D2F.AA7B3780 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------=_NextPart_000_019F_01BF7D2F.AA7B3780 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Closing of Board-L(6).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Closing of Board-L(6).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.1starnet.com (1starnet.com [207.243.104.17]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id RAA09365 [xxxxxx] Fri, 19 Feb 1999 17:29:08 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199902192329.RAA09365@[xxxxxx]> Received: from betsy [207.243.104.52] by mail.1starnet.com (SMTPD32-4.06) id A3A8CB40134; Fri, 19 Feb 1999 17:28:40 CST X-Sender: betsym@1starnet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0.1 Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 17:25:00 -0600 To: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Kay Mason , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Bill Oliver , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , Linda Russell Lewis From: Betsy Mills Subject: Re: Closing of Board-L(?) In-Reply-To: <199902190558.VAA01671@jubjub.wizard.com> References: <199902190247.SAA06287@snark.wizard.com> <36CCBA8D.DFFEC1CD@worldnet.att.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: 043a12ae27861d184b1c83734f68bd5d What is the difference between a read-only board and posting the motions to a web page? I am looking for a way that all CCs can post a response to a motion, all the board members see it, and all the other CCs can see it. If it happens that someone is rude and out of line then they come off looking bad, not us. It seems to me we could at least try it out. It is certain that what we are doing now is not working. Betsy At 09:50 PM 02/18/1999 -0800, you wrote: >On 18 Feb 99, at 20:42, Betsy Mills wrote: > >> >> Bridgett, if we can't stand allowing every cc: who wants to post a comment >> on a GenConnect board, then we can't stand for the board-l to be open and >> to "meet" only on that board. What is the difference between being >> allowed to "speak" one time (I don't think they should be allowed more >> than one post per subject, by the way) on a GenConnect board or to rant >> and rave on the lists? At least they would know that their idea or >> concern was heard. Obviously abusive or vulgar comments would be removed >> immediately. I would even offer to "oversee" such a board, but I will not >> offer to be the secretary as it stands now. > >Betsy, > >You know me I have a very bad habit of saying something, and >maybe not completely stating my whole thoughts all at one time > >The GenConnect board is a good idea. I suggest "read only" as no >one is around 24 hours a day to be able to check on it it make sure >that what a cc will post is in good taste, whether it be language >and/or appropriate, in order to remove it. > >Then we come to removing a post by a cc, now don't you think that >if we remove a post made by a CC that we would be accused of >stifling that cc's freedom of speach?? No matter if it might be at the >top of the page "Posts that are inappropriate in taste whether >language and/or content will be removed without prior notice," we will >still be accused of something. > >I propose that if a GenConnect type board is used, that a link to the >USGW page with the board member's addys on them be a link with >a suggestion that if you would like to make comment on any items to >contact your representative. > >I will say this tho, that the SE/MA region has a regional board and >the activity on that board is next to nothing. It's been announced on >the mailing list that it there, I believe it was even put on the -ALL list >when it first went up, it's on messages sent to the SE/MA mailing list >as a footnote, so at least our region does have an area where they >can post their concerns and it stands idle. I don't know what else >that we, as the SE/MA representatives, can do. > >It seems that the cc's as a whole are like the many visitors who visit >our respective county sites. The board receives more complaints on >how they are doing business than compliments. In other words, if >the cc's are happy with the status quo they are silent, however, if not >you will know about it > >Personally, I feel that even if we close down the Board-L list, have a >read only type of GenConnect Board to post minutes to, and keep >our region informed via the mailing lists, and let them know that our >"door" (email) is open to comments -- that we are NOT shutting the >cc's out. As long as we keep them informed is what the major issue >should be. > >Bridgett >Bridgett Smith >SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region > >bascs@wizard.com > >*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* > >TNGenWeb State Coordinator >http://www.tngenweb.org/ > ------=_NextPart_000_019F_01BF7D2F.AA7B3780 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Closing of Board-L.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Closing of Board-L.eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc05.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc05.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.40]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA25603 [xxxxxx] Thu, 18 Feb 1999 19:12:10 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.77.213.79]) by mtiwmhc05.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990219011140.CZBR10208@worldnet.att.net>; Fri, 19 Feb 1999 01:11:40 +0000 Message-ID: <36CCBA8D.DFFEC1CD@worldnet.att.net> Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 20:12:45 -0500 From: jpowelljr X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bridgett Smith CC: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com Subject: Re: Closing of Board-L(?) References: <00fd01be5b88$3ec60fc0$680c9cd1@william> <199902190105.RAA05888@jubjub.wizard.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 45877681acc6ca53ef383848dcade286 I will have to go along with the majority... but until my dying day I will argue that we should be totally open to the people that elected us. I can not properly represent people who don't know what I am doing. I don't even know what I can say or questions that I can ask outside of this "closed" situation. I want to be upfront with the people who elected me. I need an answer as to what I can take from here and present to those Volunteers that I represent so that I may accurately represent them. Closing of Board-L is pure folly. These clandestine meetings aren't far behind. May I ask the SE/MA list what think of the idea? If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen... Shutting the door won't help.... Excuse me, but I must vent a little, Jim ------=_NextPart_000_019F_01BF7D2F.AA7B3780 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re DBS (2).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re DBS (2).eml" Return-Path: Received: from usunwired.net (mailserver.usunwired.net [208.215.35.11]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id HAA08940 [xxxxxx] Sun, 21 Feb 1999 07:49:40 -0600 (CST) Received: from jcraven.iamerica.net [208.241.128.204] by usunwired.net (SMTPD32-4.07) id AEC22BC100F8; Sun, 21 Feb 1999 07:48:50 CDT Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19990221075051.00860880@mail.usunwired.net> X-Sender: jcraven@mail.usunwired.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 07:50:51 -0700 To: MSPIGLET@prodigy.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, hen1@IDT.NET, FEATHER2s@aol.com, jcraven@usunwired.net, bascs@snark.wizard.com, estral@switchboard.net, holt@txcyber.com, bwills@ionia-mi.net, betsym@1starnet.com, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, wnoliver@glasscity.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com, cestus3@inetnebr.com From: Jan Craven Subject: Re: DBS In-Reply-To: <199902210358.TAA13607@mail.networkone.net> References: <199902210055.QAA29465@mail.networkone.net> <36CF5222.87DDD699@worldnet.att.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: 775a31f83326ee1382d185b511c7a864 Since the formal complaint was against the archivists, as well as Linda, it was discussed on archives-L. She either checks the archives of that mailing list daily, or someone sends the messages to her. It's a closed list, but searchable. The archives volunteers do not work in secret, nor do they have anything to hide. It is my understanding that Kay's census list is closed and not searchable, but I don't know that first hand. Jan PS, Do I have everyone's address right and everyone on my cc list? I have 17 folks on there. At 07:56 PM 2/20/1999 -0800, Kay Mason wrote: >There was nothing posted to CENSUS-L about the grievance filed against >Linda. > >Kay > >Date sent: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 18:50:45 -0600 >To: Jan Craven , > Bridgett Smith , Kay Mason , > Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , > Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , > Ginger Cisewski , > Kim Harris-Myers , > Trey Holt , Bill Oliver , > Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , > Jim Powell , > Megan Zurawicz , > Lynn Watermann , > Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , > Linda Russell Lewis >From: Betsy Mills >Subject: Re: DBS > >> I would assume that someone on one of the census lists passed it on. It was >> posted to census-l, I believe is the one. >> >> Betsy >> >> >> At 07:24 PM 02/20/1999 -0500, you wrote: >> >Good Evening Good Folks, >> > >> >If you have not read the DBS for today [and I really am >> >opening >> >myself here to admitting that I occasionally visit and that is >> >not something I really wish to let her know] it has a most >> >interesting report among the others. >> > >> >How does Teresa know that there is a grievance against Linda >> >and >> >that Linda is "scrambling" around to get a counter grievance >> >filed?? How is she able to quote messages that are supposedly >> >only going to the Board?? The grievance was not known >> >outside >> >this Board and the person filing it. Is someone here >> >wanting to derail the Board again??? >> > >> >I sure can't see the advantage of closing Board-L, board >> >business >> >is apparently being leaked for purposes unknown and for >> >private >> >agendas. >> > >> >Bill >> >-- >> > >> > > >USGenWeb Census Project >http://www.usgenweb.org/census/ >http://www.usgenweb.com/census >http://www.usgenweb.net/census/ >Montgomery County Mississippi >http://www.rootsweb.com/~msmontgo/ > > ------=_NextPart_000_019F_01BF7D2F.AA7B3780 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re DBS (3).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re DBS (3).eml" Return-Path: Received: from imo13.mx.aol.com (imo13.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.3]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA09442 [xxxxxx] Sat, 20 Feb 1999 18:45:39 -0600 (CST) From: FEATHER2s@aol.com Received: from FEATHER2s@aol.com by imo13.mx.aol.com (IMOv18.1) id 9QMQa05309; Sat, 20 Feb 1999 19:40:21 +1900 (EST) Message-ID: <737c710f.36cf55f5@aol.com> Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 19:40:21 EST To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com Cc: jcraven@usunwired.net, bascs@snark.wizard.com, kmfkm@ptw.com, pamreid@dc.jones.com, hen1@IDT.NET, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, bwills@ionia-mi.net, estral@switchboard.net, holt@txcyber.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: DBS Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 205 X-UIDL: bc099e03280ef2844a48356e8fc25c94 Well, Bill is right! She is quoting verbatim from that grievance...! There must be NO leaks, especially regarding grievances!! Those, above all else, are filed in confidentiality and when one of us violates that trust, we do major damage to the credibility and trustworthiness of the Board, not to mention the Project as a whole. I am shocked and dismayed and those who elected us deserve far better! Ginger ------=_NextPart_000_019F_01BF7D2F.AA7B3780 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re DBS (4).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re DBS (4).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.1starnet.com (1starnet.com [207.243.104.17]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id SAA10897 [xxxxxx] Sat, 20 Feb 1999 18:54:45 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199902210054.SAA10897@[xxxxxx]> Received: from betsy [207.243.104.39] by mail.1starnet.com (SMTPD32-4.06) id A941F950112; Sat, 20 Feb 1999 18:54:25 CST X-Sender: betsym@1starnet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0.1 Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 18:50:45 -0600 To: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Kay Mason , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Bill Oliver , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , Linda Russell Lewis From: Betsy Mills Subject: Re: DBS In-Reply-To: <36CF5222.87DDD699@worldnet.att.net> References: <199902190247.SAA06287@snark.wizard.com> <36CCBA8D.DFFEC1CD@worldnet.att.net> <19990219233256.LKSO3297@mail.1starnet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: 66cdd8485c23adbce694c950614c4193 I would assume that someone on one of the census lists passed it on. It was posted to census-l, I believe is the one. Betsy At 07:24 PM 02/20/1999 -0500, you wrote: >Good Evening Good Folks, > >If you have not read the DBS for today [and I really am >opening >myself here to admitting that I occasionally visit and that is >not something I really wish to let her know] it has a most >interesting report among the others. > >How does Teresa know that there is a grievance against Linda >and >that Linda is "scrambling" around to get a counter grievance >filed?? How is she able to quote messages that are supposedly >only going to the Board?? The grievance was not known >outside >this Board and the person filing it. Is someone here >wanting to derail the Board again??? > >I sure can't see the advantage of closing Board-L, board >business >is apparently being leaked for purposes unknown and for >private >agendas. > >Bill >-- > ------=_NextPart_000_019F_01BF7D2F.AA7B3780 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re DBS (5).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re DBS (5).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.tds.net (mail.tds.net [204.246.1.2]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA26499 [xxxxxx] Sat, 20 Feb 1999 20:26:39 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (pemiusr0-a18.shiatel.tds.net [208.165.220.18]) by mail.tds.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id UAA06114; Sat, 20 Feb 1999 20:26:35 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19990220212629.006c5a38@mail.tds.net> X-Sender: mishiawa@mail.tds.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 21:26:29 -0600 To: Celia Snyder , Lynn Watermann From: Bonnie McVicar-Briggs Subject: Re: DBS Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: 4afd453e11131120d04fd57c79072bf5 Celia and Lynn, Had to resend this to you as I messed up your addresses the first time around. Sorry. I just cut and pasted this from the original I sent. As a CC, I have long wondered where she gets this stuff. This isn't new, it's happened for months. She openly laughs at the board as they try to figure out who her sources are. On a different note: Look at the headers below from recent posts to this cc list. I set up my address book to have one address entry for all board members, based on headers from the first posts sent to me from this list. Pam is no longer a board member is she? Who is supposed to be on this list? To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com Cc: jcraven@usunwired.net, bascs@snark.wizard.com, kmfkm@ptw.com, pamreid@dc.jones.com, hen1@IDT.NET, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, bwills@ionia-mi.net, estral@switchboard.net, holt@txcyber.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com To: Betsy Mills CC: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Kay Mason , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , Linda Russell Lewis To: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Kay Mason , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Bill Oliver , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , Linda Russell Lewis Bonnie McVicar-Briggs mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net USGENWEB PROJECT Volunteer Shiawassee County, MI http://www.rootsweb.com/~mishiawa/mishiawa.html Clinton County, MI http://www.rootsweb.com/~miclinto/clintmn.htm Wayne County, MI http://www.rootsweb.com/~miwayne/wayne.htm ------=_NextPart_000_019F_01BF7D2F.AA7B3780-- [xxxxxxx] Tue Feb 22 13:25:21 2000 [xxxxxxx] Received: from mail1.radix.net (mail1.radix.net [207.192.128.31]) by saltmine.radix.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA15327 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:25:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from [xxxxxx] ([xxxxxx] [199.184.119.1]) by mail1.radix.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA22065 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:25:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (nei-pm2-018.inetnebr.com [206.222.223.92]) by [xxxxxx] (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA18260; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:25:10 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <01b701bf7d62$12f24ec0$5cdfdece@default> [xxxxxxx] To: "merope" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:24:34 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_01B4_01BF7D2F.C857DEC0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01B4_01BF7D2F.C857DEC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------=_NextPart_000_01B4_01BF7D2F.C857DEC0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re DBS (6).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re DBS (6).eml" Return-Path: Received: from dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.11]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA27396 [xxxxxx] Sun, 21 Feb 1999 12:59:35 -0600 (CST) Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id MAA29687; Sun, 21 Feb 1999 12:54:16 -0600 (CST) Received: from irv-ca39-08.ix.netcom.com(207.93.50.200) by dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma029661; Sun Feb 21 12:54:00 1999 Message-ID: <36D055CD.1C71@ix.netcom.com> Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 10:51:57 -0800 From: Linda Russell Lewis Organization: USGenWeb Archives, VAGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-NC320 (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jan Craven CC: MSPIGLET@prodigy.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, hen1@IDT.NET, FEATHER2s@aol.com, bascs@snark.wizard.com, estral@switchboard.net, holt@txcyber.com, bwills@ionia-mi.net, betsym@1starnet.com, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, wnoliver@glasscity.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com Subject: Re: DBS References: <199902210055.QAA29465@mail.networkone.net> <36CF5222.87DDD699@worldnet.att.net> <3.0.1.32.19990221075051.00860880@mail.usunwired.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 90aa2708680ae1504b900fdd2e776313 The Tombstone Project mailing lists are also searchable. Anyone can search those lists anytime. http://searches.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/listsearch.pl Linda Jan Craven wrote: > > Since the formal complaint was against the archivists, as well as Linda, > it was discussed on archives-L. She either checks the archives of that > mailing list daily, or someone sends the messages to her. It's a closed > list, but searchable. The archives volunteers do not work in secret, nor > do they have anything to hide. > It is my understanding that Kay's census list is closed and not searchable, > but > I don't know that first hand. > Jan > ------=_NextPart_000_01B4_01BF7D2F.C857DEC0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re DBS.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re DBS.eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.networkone.net (root@mail.networkone.net [209.144.112.75]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA12570 [xxxxxx] Sat, 20 Feb 1999 21:59:07 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (kay@assured-01-142.ln.networkone.net [209.144.118.143]) by mail.networkone.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id TAA13607; Sat, 20 Feb 1999 19:58:43 -0800 Message-Id: <199902210358.TAA13607@mail.networkone.net> From: "Kay Mason" To: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Kay Mason , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Bill Oliver , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , Linda Russell Lewis , Betsy Mills Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 19:56:04 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: DBS Reply-to: kmfkm@ptw.com Priority: normal In-reply-to: <199902210055.QAA29465@mail.networkone.net> References: <36CF5222.87DDD699@worldnet.att.net> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT X-UIDL: db8ebf1c1b0606230757d189011da22a There was nothing posted to CENSUS-L about the grievance filed against Linda. Kay Date sent: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 18:50:45 -0600 To: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Kay Mason , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Bill Oliver , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , Linda Russell Lewis From: Betsy Mills Subject: Re: DBS > I would assume that someone on one of the census lists passed it on. It was > posted to census-l, I believe is the one. > > Betsy > > > At 07:24 PM 02/20/1999 -0500, you wrote: > >Good Evening Good Folks, > > > >If you have not read the DBS for today [and I really am > >opening > >myself here to admitting that I occasionally visit and that is > >not something I really wish to let her know] it has a most > >interesting report among the others. > > > >How does Teresa know that there is a grievance against Linda > >and > >that Linda is "scrambling" around to get a counter grievance > >filed?? How is she able to quote messages that are supposedly > >only going to the Board?? The grievance was not known > >outside > >this Board and the person filing it. Is someone here > >wanting to derail the Board again??? > > > >I sure can't see the advantage of closing Board-L, board > >business > >is apparently being leaked for purposes unknown and for > >private > >agendas. > > > >Bill > >-- > > > USGenWeb Census Project http://www.usgenweb.org/census/ http://www.usgenweb.com/census http://www.usgenweb.net/census/ Montgomery County Mississippi http://www.rootsweb.com/~msmontgo/ ------=_NextPart_000_01B4_01BF7D2F.C857DEC0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Discussion.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Discussion.eml" Return-Path: Received: from dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.4]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA13223 [xxxxxx] Sun, 28 Feb 1999 17:23:50 -0600 (CST) From: cityslic@ix.netcom.com Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id RAA15635; Sun, 28 Feb 1999 17:15:44 -0600 (CST) Received: from tfx-us5-12.ix.netcom.com(204.30.67.172) by dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma015526; Sun Feb 28 17:15:12 1999 Message-ID: <36D9C3AE.1718@ix.netcom.com> Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 17:31:10 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-NC320 (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: kmfkm@ptw.com CC: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Bill Oliver , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs Subject: Re: Discussion References: <199902271810.KAA04428@mail.networkone.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 0f2ac205b9bfc043f3905219a847edc3 Kay Mason wrote: > > Linda says that I refuse to talk to her.. however... > > When the conflict first began between the two > of us, I asked Brian Leverich for assistance and comments. He > made some suggestions which I found workable at that time; > however, apparently the Linda did not agree. Brian then stepped > out. > "Apparently"? Please let me know what the suggestions were. I don't recall Brian suggesting anything.. so how could I not agree? > Linda continued to cover the same ground over and over, and over > again. All of her arguments were pre-ByLaws, which changed the > organization of the USGenWeb Project Archives, and made the the > Archival Projects separate and equal. This approach does not and > will not work for a progressive future of USGenWeb Project or its > Archival Projects. What arguments? Kay, please tell me when the communication broke down between us. As I recall, you stopped speaking to me when SK Publications signed a contract with the USGenWeb Archives. You, Brian and I were on IRC and you expressed concern that states like KS would be successful in fragmenting the Archives and you were worried about the census files. Brian and I both assured you that it would not happen. The Archives would remain intact. The next thing I know.. after weeks of no answering my ICQ messages or mail, you fired me as the VA census assistant (without telling me), and started building the census archives. I did bring this up to board members and out of courtesy for the board at that time, didn't want to ask them to step into the problem when they were dealing with the new nc resigning and all the mess on -all. So I waiting, hoping something would be worked out. > > Whe it became apparent that the discussions were stalemated, I > terminated the fruitless conversations. Life is too short and the > future is already here and there is no reason to continue arguing > pointlessly without some sort of solution-seeking goals. > > Thanks, > > Kay Linda ------=_NextPart_000_01B4_01BF7D2F.C857DEC0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Enough is enough (2).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Enough is enough (2).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.networkone.net (root@mail.networkone.net [209.144.112.75]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA20768 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 20:11:47 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (assured-01-43.ln.networkone.net [209.144.118.44]) by mail.networkone.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id SAA04166; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 18:11:45 -0800 Message-Id: <199902170211.SAA04166@mail.networkone.net> From: "Kay Mason" To: "Yvonne James-Henderson" , "Trey Holt" , "Tim Stowell" , "Megan Zurawicz" , "Lynn Watermann" , "Kim Harris Myers" , "Jim Powell" , "Ginger Cisewski" , "Celia Snyder" , "Bridgett" , "Bonnie McVicar Briggs" , "Bill Oliver" , "Betsy" , "Kay Mason" , "Jan Craven" , "Beth Wills" Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 18:06:02 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Enough is enough Reply-to: kmfkm@ptw.com Priority: urgent In-reply-to: <01be5a18$185214e0$35bb8ecf@default> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT X-UIDL: a83103f371540862376d7a8da39265f7 Hi Beth, Do you remember when we all promised each other that we would stick it out together untill September???? If things are a mess it's sure not your fault. You did everything that you could to hold the project together when you were acting NC, and we appreciate it.. To be real honest with you, I don't know where we are either, but, lets get together, and lets work together.. now! We will NOT accept your resignation.. Kay From: "Beth Wills" To: "Yvonne James-Henderson" , "Trey Holt" , "Tim Stowell" , "Megan Zurawicz" , "Lynn Watermann" , "Kim Harris Myers" , "Jim Powell" , "Ginger Cisewski" , "Celia Snyder" , "Bridgett" , "Bonnie McVicar Briggs" , "Bill Oliver" , "Betsy" , "Kay Mason" , "Jan Craven" Subject: Enough is enough Date sent: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 20:51:54 -0500 > Since September I have weathered the comings and goings of a number of > members of this board, and I have taken my share of the pot shots. I have > learned to deal with a variety of issues, but what I can not deal with is > the fact that we aren't doing anything! > > We have been sitting on this census vs. archives thing for 8 DAYS! During > this time we have delt with a few little issues like logos and such, but we > have not addressed the biggest issue that stands to tear this project apart. > We have several motions on the table, we are in the middle of one vote and > still nothing is being done! Things are such a mess it is a wonder that > anyone can tell what is going on. > I can't stand it - it is driving me nuts - and it has driven me beyond > effectiveness. > > Effective immediately - I resign my position on the board. Sorry, Kay, you > ran the NE / NC run off election for nothing because now the number 2 person > on the ballot can have my spot. Good luck to all of you! It has been a > pleasure knowing and working with you all. > > Beth > USGenWeb Census Project http://www.usgenweb.org/census/ http://www.usgenweb.com/census http://www.usgenweb.net/census/ Montgomery County Mississippi http://www.rootsweb.com/~msmontgo/ ------=_NextPart_000_01B4_01BF7D2F.C857DEC0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Enough is enough.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Enough is enough.eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.1starnet.com (1starnet.com [207.243.104.17]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id UAA17825 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 20:00:00 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199902170200.UAA17825@[xxxxxx]> Received: from betsy [207.243.104.157] by mail.1starnet.com (SMTPD32-4.06) id A29849F010C; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 19:59:52 CST X-Sender: betsym@1starnet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0.1 Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 19:56:13 -0600 To: "Beth Wills" , "Yvonne James-Henderson" , "Trey Holt" , "Tim Stowell" , "Megan Zurawicz" , "Lynn Watermann" , "Kim Harris Myers" , "Jim Powell" , "Ginger Cisewski" , "Celia Snyder" , "Bridgett" , "Bonnie McVicar Briggs" , "Bill Oliver" , "Kay Mason" , "Jan Craven" From: Betsy Mills Subject: Re: Enough is enough In-Reply-To: <01be5a18$185214e0$35bb8ecf@default> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: 0eac34f48414c931c66bf96a4efbb28d Beth, Why are you doing this?? Because I asked for discussion first?? Because I asked for formal votes to be done on the board list?? What in the world brought on this reaction?? It seems that every time I ask a question, someone resigns. Maybe the wrong person is resigning!! Betsy At 08:51 PM 02/16/1999 -0500, Beth Wills wrote: >Since September I have weathered the comings and goings of a number of >members of this board, and I have taken my share of the pot shots. I have >learned to deal with a variety of issues, but what I can not deal with is >the fact that we aren't doing anything! > >We have been sitting on this census vs. archives thing for 8 DAYS! During >this time we have delt with a few little issues like logos and such, but we >have not addressed the biggest issue that stands to tear this project apart. >We have several motions on the table, we are in the middle of one vote and >still nothing is being done! Things are such a mess it is a wonder that >anyone can tell what is going on. >I can't stand it - it is driving me nuts - and it has driven me beyond >effectiveness. > >Effective immediately - I resign my position on the board. Sorry, Kay, you >ran the NE / NC run off election for nothing because now the number 2 person >on the ballot can have my spot. Good luck to all of you! It has been a >pleasure knowing and working with you all. > >Beth > ------=_NextPart_000_01B4_01BF7D2F.C857DEC0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Escalation (2).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Escalation (2).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc06.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc06.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.41]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA27769 [xxxxxx] Sat, 27 Feb 1999 13:05:20 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.67.146.140]) by mtiwmhc06.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990227190448.FSG28655@worldnet.att.net>; Sat, 27 Feb 1999 19:04:48 +0000 Message-ID: <36D84189.8B9F9EF8@worldnet.att.net> Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 14:03:38 -0500 From: William N Oliver Reply-To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net Organization: NEGenWeb/OHGenWeb/USGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,nl,de-CH,de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bridgett Smith CC: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com Subject: Re: Escalation References: <199902271719.JAA16212@jubjub.wizard.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: e7928b7abcab43b52b49981395244f50 Bridgett Smith wrote: > This is sort of responding to Yvonne's last message. > > To begin with if there are secret meetings on Mirc I know nothing > about them. The last time I was on IRC was the night I introduced > Linda to the bingozone . The reason I was there that time was to > see if Nancy Trice was on line to find out about a message she > posted to the SC mailing list regarding TNGenWeb and its bylaws. I > didn't stay very long, I never do. > > If I have failed to say in the past that I thought Linda has done an > admirable job with the archives, I stand admonished. The task of > starting up the archives and getting it to the point where it is today > was a monumental one. My hat is off to her. > > My original posting which started all this discussion was not meant to > bash Linda, but to find out exactly what she meant by her post to the > SE/MA list. Could I have asked her privately? Yes, I probably could > have -- but then I was also trying to see if I was the only one to take > her message the way I perceived it to be. I wanted to know if I > needed to rethink my opinion of the message. As I stated in my > original message, everyone does not read the same post in the > same way, and different "messages" are read into the same post. > > >From there this discussion has escalated to where it is today, which > indicates to me that there is a definite problem somewhere within the > Archives project. Mixed messages are being sent out, and questions > are not being answered directly, they are being skirted around, if > answered at all (and not only on Linda's part). > > No one came to the board, not Kay -- not Linda, NO ONE -- to find > out, to complain or advise us of any rift was growing between those > two people which may have reprocussions on the entire project. > Both Kay and Linda are equal in being wrong on this matter [[please > remember anything I say starting with this paragraph is *my* > opinion only]]. Because they didn't bring this to the board's attention > when all of this started, we are at the point where we are today. > > Yvonne states: > >>>> > She [Linda] has a REAL complaint here and not one of you > addressed her complaint, but were quick to take sides and label > Linda a troublemaker.<<<<< > > What is her complaint? That we've questioned some of her remarks > made in posts??? That Kay sneaked off with the Archives and the > Archive volunteers? When/if Kay did so why wasn't this complaint > brought up to us when this occurred, not 6 months later [time frame > derived from a post by Linda saying the USGWP Census Project > apparently created in Sept 1998]? > > What I am really distressed about now is a post made by Linda > yesterday: > > >>>> > I guess they are still a part of The USGenWeb Project, until the > majority of the volunteers vote that they are not.<<<< > > This statement really scares me. And also is in contradiction to a > previous statement made by Linda that the USGWP Archives Project > is not "owned" by the USGW Project, but the submitters of > information to it -- seems to me the volunteers shouldn't even have a > say so in this matter but all of the submitters. > > When this situation came up right after the elections, I suggested > that this should be taken to a grievance committee, and I still think it > should have been. I am not saying the outcome would have been > any different, but I believe 2 or 3 people could have gotten down to > the nitty gritty of this situation a whole lot better than 15. > > Bridgett > > Bridgett Smith > SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region > > bascs@wizard.com > > *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* > > TNGenWeb State Coordinator > http://www.tngenweb.org/ Some great points. But my take is, blame the very lack of consensus on leadership. We split into sides as to who should fill a minor position [yet important] of secretary. What started as a simple motion has been allowed to escalate no differently than the Special Project issue. The SP Issue is a total board responsibility, which includes both disputing members. That is your By-Laws on grievances. And, for my take, I'm glad the BLs state so for the Special Project issue is too important not to be handled by the entire Board [ALL sixteen of us]. I can see "vested" interest all over the issue, but we were elected because we were presumed to be "leaders" and above such. A proposal: Select a third party fact finder [non board], add one additional person [not AB] from each realm [Archives and Census], define what their duties would be, present their fact findings and recommendations to the Board for Vote. The AB could still turn down the recommendations and try again, but it is a plan toward solution. At any rate, I'm willing to chance the total integrity of the AB. Bill -- ------=_NextPart_000_01B4_01BF7D2F.C857DEC0-- [xxxxxxx] Tue Feb 22 13:26:12 2000 [xxxxxxx] Received: from mail1.radix.net (mail1.radix.net [207.192.128.31]) by saltmine.radix.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA15409 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:26:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from [xxxxxx] ([xxxxxx] [199.184.119.1]) by mail1.radix.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA22228 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:26:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (nei-pm2-018.inetnebr.com [206.222.223.92]) by [xxxxxx] (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA18605; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:26:01 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <01c401bf7d62$31754820$5cdfdece@default> [xxxxxxx] To: "merope" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:25:25 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_01C1_01BF7D2F.E6D1B060" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01C1_01BF7D2F.E6D1B060 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------=_NextPart_000_01C1_01BF7D2F.E6D1B060 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Escalation (3).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Escalation (3).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.1starnet.com (1starnet.com [207.243.104.17]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id NAA05708 [xxxxxx] Sat, 27 Feb 1999 13:49:35 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199902271949.NAA05708@[xxxxxx]> Received: from betsy [207.243.104.62] by mail.1starnet.com (SMTPD32-4.06) id AC0A9510130; Sat, 27 Feb 1999 13:48:26 CST X-Sender: betsym@1starnet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0.1 Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 13:44:54 -0600 To: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Kay Mason , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Bill Oliver , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , Linda Russell Lewis From: Betsy Mills Subject: Re: Escalation In-Reply-To: <36D84189.8B9F9EF8@worldnet.att.net> References: <199902271719.JAA16212@jubjub.wizard.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: 57f15bfd5e01220d2ac3c2f84c222287 At 02:03 PM 02/27/1999 -0500, you wrote: >Some great points. But my take is, blame the very lack of consensus on >leadership. We split into sides as to who should fill a minor position [yet >important] of secretary. What started as a simple motion has been allowed >to escalate no differently than the Special Project issue. Whoa, Bill!! Why do you think this is a split into sides on the vote for a secretary??? One of the reasons I wanted to keep the vote private was to keep it from becoming just that. Do you see my vote for Tim as a vote AGAINST you??? Heaven forbid!!! I can work with you if you win the same as I can work with Tim. I guess my nominating Tim was my statement that I don't see the need for a secretary. Tim has been told so much that he CAN'T do that I just don't see why he can't handle tracking the votes. If the rest of the board disagrees with me, so be it. I have been on the losing side of a vote before and I don't believe I hold a grudge. Can YOU work with Tim if you win??? I certainly hope so and believe that you can. It is my feeling that as secretary you should PRIVATELY help Tim if he has a question about PPP. You are very good on that subject and so you should be helping Tim learn the ropes, not waiting till he falls through them and then pointing out where he messed up. I am only on the side of the USGenWeb Project. Thanks for listening. Betsy ------=_NextPart_000_01C1_01BF7D2F.E6D1B060 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Escalation (4).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Escalation (4).eml" Return-Path: Received: from jubjub.wizard.com (jubjub.wizard.com [199.171.28.9]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA05719 [xxxxxx] Sat, 27 Feb 1999 13:49:39 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (pm3-3-095.wizard.com [208.211.54.95]) by jubjub.wizard.com (8.9.2/8.9.0) with SMTP id LAA24731; Sat, 27 Feb 1999 11:49:04 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199902271949.LAA24731@jubjub.wizard.com> From: "Bridgett Smith" To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 11:48:44 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Escalation Priority: normal In-reply-to: <199902271853.KAA05616@snark.wizard.com> References: <199902271719.JAA16212@jubjub.wizard.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) X-UIDL: 714328d32e8e2a03ef36d8ba1c6c1db0 Observation from someone who is not connected with either the Archives [A] nor the Census Project [CP]: It was brought to the attention of the CP coordinator that a person's name was removed upon recreation of pages for that directory. The name now appears at the bottom of the page. CP has link to the A Census Project, no reciprocal link on A to CP CP coordinator states no files were removed, just copied to CP directory (makes sense to me, but what do I know) -- this doesn't seem to be a major obstacle. (again my opinion, but what do I know) CP coordinator indicates that the file managers in A are being notified of any files uploaded; according to a message from the A coordinator, the CP wouldn't be interested in the "snippets" or partial census uploaded to the archives, which may be true, however are the CP managers being notified if "WHOLE" censuses are being notified? Dunno that part wasn't addressed I don't think. What else was CP suppose to give or the advisory board to ask of this project?? I am not saying there isn't anything else, but I can't see the forest for the trees right now. I want to make one thing very clear here. I like both Kay and Linda, they both have done wondeful, outstanding work and contributed vasts amount of time for the USGW Project. My hat is off to them, as they both have contributed more to this project than I ever will. HOWEVER, my awe at their dedication and their contribution to this project does not alter the fact that I disagree with some of the actions both of these gals have taken. I am going to be very, very blunt right now. I may cause some folks to never talk to me again, so be it. As I see it, this rift, problem or whatever you want to call it is caused by a "ME" syndrome in both parties. Even though Kay has obliged on some items I mentioned above, it was the "ME" attitude that took over to not get the opinions of her peers before another census project (so to speak, lack of better words) was created. It is now the "ME" attitude that Linda is presenting when in essense it all boils down to her not even admitting that she *might* be wrong in some areas. Well, folks, the "ME" attitude just doesn't cut it when it involves the whole project, and not just a segment of it, and believe me this rift involves the whole project. As some of you folks know that have been on this board from Sept 1998, that I was of the opinion that that the Archives, Census, and Tombstone projects were equal to any XXGenWeb state project. I have changed my mind on that thought. You see no matter what happens within a XXGenWeb State Project, it doesn't effect the whole of the project itself, a state could even pull out of the project, but it would not effect the WHOLE of the project. However, the Digital Library area of this project effects everyone, the project, the county hosts, the state coordinators AND the researchers. It is of my opinion that any major changes within this Digital Library should be presented to the board before said changes were made. We (the project) can not continue to retain the respect we do in the genealogical internet community if the national areas of this project cannot be dealt with efficiently whether it be changes and or restructuring. Bridgett On 27 Feb 99, at 12:49, Betsy Mills wrote: > I agree whole-heartedly -- > both are in the wrong. Both should give a little. The statement does say > what Linda is supposed to give, but nothing is said about what Kay has to > give. > > Betsy Bridgett Smith SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region bascs@wizard.com *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* TNGenWeb State Coordinator http://www.tngenweb.org/ ------=_NextPart_000_01C1_01BF7D2F.E6D1B060 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Escalation (5).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Escalation (5).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc06.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc06.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.41]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA22085 [xxxxxx] Sat, 27 Feb 1999 15:15:50 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.67.146.140]) by mtiwmhc06.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990227211516.BMXA28655@worldnet.att.net>; Sat, 27 Feb 1999 21:15:16 +0000 Message-ID: <36D8601F.8FBDBBCE@worldnet.att.net> Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 16:14:07 -0500 From: William N Oliver Reply-To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net Organization: NEGenWeb/OHGenWeb/USGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,nl,de-CH,de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Betsy Mills CC: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Kay Mason , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , Linda Russell Lewis Subject: Re: Escalation References: <199902271719.JAA16212@jubjub.wizard.com> <19990227195212.NZNZ24480@mail.1starnet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: bf57262017a6d133b2886340b58bd713 Betsy Mills wrote: > At 02:03 PM 02/27/1999 -0500, you wrote: > >Some great points. But my take is, blame the very lack of consensus on > >leadership. We split into sides as to who should fill a minor position [yet > >important] of secretary. What started as a simple motion has been allowed > >to escalate no differently than the Special Project issue. > > Whoa, Bill!! Why do you think this is a split into sides on the vote for a > secretary??? One of the reasons I wanted to keep the vote private was to keep > it from becoming just that. Do you see my vote for Tim as a vote AGAINST > you??? Heaven forbid!!! I can work with you if you win the same as I can > work > with Tim. I guess my nominating Tim was my statement that I don't see the > need > for a secretary. Tim has been told so much that he CAN'T do that I just don't > see why he can't handle tracking the votes. If the rest of the board > disagrees > with me, so be it. I have been on the losing side of a vote before and I > don't > believe I hold a grudge. > > Can YOU work with Tim if you win??? I certainly hope so and believe that you > can. It is my feeling that as secretary you should PRIVATELY help Tim if he > has a question about PPP. You are very good on that subject and so you should > be helping Tim learn the ropes, not waiting till he falls through them and > then > pointing out where he messed up. > > I am only on the side of the USGenWeb Project. > > Thanks for listening. > Betsy Betsy, Didn't mean to offend you [or anyone], just stating some things as I see them. There were three posts sitting in Draft mode, waiting for me to either rewrite them or send them [I do try to follow my own rules]. One I just sent out which contains the generally accepted views on positions in any organization. That post, plus my answer to Yvonne's post [still sitting in Draft mode], should have preceded the one which you just answered. [The latter one probably won't get sent -- obvious reasons] It is still my gut feeling that there is a perception of competition. I'm pleased to back down in at least your case. For those that know me well, know that I am an action person. Spinning wheels doesn't sit well with me. I'd rather make a mistake than sit on my hands. Due to this trait I lead, I am a leader, in the absence of leadership, I will lead. As you have already experienced, that does not mean people blindly follow or follow at all. If folk don't follow I'll keep throwing things out there until something allow conclusion. One further point, I haven't seen any vote for Tim as a vote "against" me. Votes are an expression of personal evaluations of situations [I hope]. A person interpreting my actions as competing for leadership would fall into the category "of contributing to the lack of consensus on leadership". Yes, I can work with Tim. Yes, I can help him. And, have attempted to do so privately. I'm am not always correct, that's a fact. The NC puts his own boots on. If he asks for help he gets it. Otherwise he is corrected if necessary. No differently than you just did for me. [and no offense has been taken] My experience is some fifty years of organizations of many types, public service type, societies, and corporations. My only objection to Tim being secretary is not personal it positional. He is the Chair. As for counting votes, I'm sure he is capable, and I don't believe that was the point. My thoughts were that a secretary would be of help to the NC's position and in my case, it would put us in closer communications which could only help facilitate things, not usurp authority. Take that for what you will. Sincerely, Bill -- P.S. Thanks for the compliment(s). ------=_NextPart_000_01C1_01BF7D2F.E6D1B060 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Escalation (7).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Escalation (7).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.tds.net (mail.tds.net [204.246.1.2]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA17325 [xxxxxx] Sat, 27 Feb 1999 23:23:30 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (pemiusr0-a108.shiatel.tds.net [208.165.220.108]) by mail.tds.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id XAA17397; Sat, 27 Feb 1999 23:23:12 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19990228002143.006c6014@mail.tds.net> X-Sender: mishiawa@mail.tds.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 00:21:43 -0600 To: Yvonne James-Henderson , Trey Holt , Beth Wills , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Kim Harris Meyers , Kay Mason , Jim Powell , Jan Craven , Ginger Cisewski , Celia Snyder , Bridgett , Betsy Mills , Bill Oliver , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , Tim Stowell , Linda Lewis From: Bonnie McVicar-Briggs Subject: Re: Escalation Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: 85e872afdbb220494e8f97cceb7aa1f5 This isn't in answer to any one person. I have read all the posts from the past few days on this and have had some correspondence with both Linda and Kay about the Census Project. What I have to say is my opinion and should be treated as just that. The archives project is, in it's very description, "The USGenWeb Digital Library (Archives)", a library. Those involved in the archives project and other special projects have done an admiral job of giving us a place to store data. Creating this library was a tremendous undertaking and has no doubt lead to proprietary feelings amoung all parties concerned. >From what I have gathered in all this, Linda and the archive file managers want to keep all the files in one directory, one room if you will. They want their file managers to upload files to the directories of that room. Kay on the other hand sees the census information should go into a directory or room of it's own and her file managers should do the uploading. Partly, if I have this right, due to the archive file managers objecting to the census file managers getting into their directories to upload files. It seems perfectly logical that as any library grows, expansion is needed to house new information. More rooms or directories must be added to keep up with the growth and more librarians or file managers must be brought on board to handle the amount of work that must be done. As each special project, no matter where it's beginnings come from, grows and adds files, it will need to and should eventually be placed in it's own directory and have it's own file managers. Otherwise the work for the archive file managers or the need for several people having passwords to any given archive directories will create chaos. People will become overloaded with files to upload. This is already happening in some places. Starting at the Census Project page at http://www.usgenweb.org/census/ and clicking on USGW Census Project Archives link you are taken to a states page. Using the ftp links, one needs only to click on the state wanted to get to a page that tells which counties have census records. Using the link to the USGW Archives , you are taken to a states page and then to a directory which lists counties, Click a county page, I used Clinton, Shiawassee and Washtenaw, and you still aren't at a page that tells you if there is a census there. Now you have to click each file to find the census. That's alot of wasted steps for someone looking for a census record and paying for online time. While not all visitors are going to come through the back door to the county archives, many are and it seems to me this is a round about way to get there. Libraries are not set up this way. Each subject has it's own section and it is relatively easy to find what you need in them. I think it's time the archives started to resemble the library they propose to be and that by taking the census files and placing them under a seperate directory called census is the first step in that direction. This will not destroy the archives project it will enhance it and make it easier for our visitors to find what they are looking for no matter how they get to the archives. This should be done with all special projects. If it is possible to create sub-directories within the archives to hold the files from the special projects, and have the uploading of files handled by the SP file managers, I think that would solve the problem. But if this isn't possible, then separate directories are needed to keep the information together under one file type or library section. To say that the archives can't guarantee the files if not placed in the archive directory is to say that the other project managers are apt to steal them and take them anywhere. What prevents the archives managers from doing the same thing? To question the integrity of one is to question all. As I see it, we as a board can sit here and say we can't do anything, or we can try to find a solution and a workable answer. If the parties involved can't come to a workable agreement with us, then it is our responsiblity to find the best solution to a problem that effects the whole project and present it to the project for input. I am asking both the archives and census project to abide by the motion sent by this board, until we can find a worklable solution. If that can't be done please tell me why it can't. Either way I would like an answer. Since another objection seems to be that the census data isn't searchable under the census directory, I propose we get Karen or Brian in here to tell us if it can be made to be searchable. Lest anyone think I am taking sides, I never talked to Kay until I became a board member and I have only ever talked to Linda a handful of times. I am only stating it as I see it. Bonnie McVicar-Briggs mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net USGENWEB PROJECT Volunteer Shiawassee County, MI http://www.rootsweb.com/~mishiawa/mishiawa.html Clinton County, MI http://www.rootsweb.com/~miclinto/clintmn.htm Wayne County, MI http://www.rootsweb.com/~miwayne/wayne.htm ------=_NextPart_000_01C1_01BF7D2F.E6D1B060 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Escalation.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Escalation.eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.1starnet.com (1starnet.com [207.243.104.17]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id MAA25637 [xxxxxx] Sat, 27 Feb 1999 12:53:22 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199902271853.MAA25637@[xxxxxx]> Received: from betsy [207.243.104.62] by mail.1starnet.com (SMTPD32-4.06) id AEFE19460112; Sat, 27 Feb 1999 12:52:46 CST X-Sender: betsym@1starnet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0.1 Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 12:49:13 -0600 To: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Kay Mason , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Bill Oliver , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , Linda Russell Lewis From: Betsy Mills Subject: Re: Escalation In-Reply-To: <199902271719.JAA16212@jubjub.wizard.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: b707f69908bfe3e0598ff673bb96b69c At 09:18 AM 02/27/1999 -0800, you wrote: >No one came to the board, not Kay -- not Linda, NO ONE -- to find >out, to complain or advise us of any rift was growing between those >two people which may have reprocussions on the entire project. >Both Kay and Linda are equal in being wrong on this matter [[please >remember anything I say starting with this paragraph is *my* >opinion only]]. Because they didn't bring this to the board's attention >when all of this started, we are at the point where we are today. Well, Bridgett, this is partly my fault. I and some others advised Linda not to stir up things. For one thing, Brian had stated that he was NOT going to create a separate directory for Kay. So, I felt safe in telling Linda that Kay couldn't split the census project out of the archives. So much for what I know. I also keep telling Linda that the data is still going into the archives, so even though Kay did go about this in the wrong way, I don't understand what the disaster is. I agree whole-heartedly -- both are in the wrong. Both should give a little. The statement does say what Linda is supposed to give, but nothing is said about what Kay has to give. Betsy ------=_NextPart_000_01C1_01BF7D2F.E6D1B060 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Escalation (6).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Escalation (6).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.1starnet.com (1starnet.com [207.243.104.17]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id PAA23316 [xxxxxx] Sat, 27 Feb 1999 15:21:39 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199902272121.PAA23316@[xxxxxx]> Received: from betsy [207.243.104.62] by mail.1starnet.com (SMTPD32-4.06) id A1A0111100F2; Sat, 27 Feb 1999 15:20:32 CST X-Sender: betsym@1starnet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0.1 Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 15:17:00 -0600 To: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Kay Mason , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Bill Oliver , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , Linda Russell Lewis From: Betsy Mills Subject: Re: Escalation In-Reply-To: <36D8601F.8FBDBBCE@worldnet.att.net> References: <199902271719.JAA16212@jubjub.wizard.com> <19990227195212.NZNZ24480@mail.1starnet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: a0734ffa5ccdade8487297f0dd68e237 Thanks, Bill!!! I am glad I misunderstood what you were saying. Betsy At 04:14 PM 02/27/1999 -0500, you wrote: >Betsy Mills wrote: > >> At 02:03 PM 02/27/1999 -0500, you wrote: >> >Some great points. But my take is, blame the very lack of consensus on >> >leadership. We split into sides as to who should fill a minor position [yet >> >important] of secretary. What started as a simple motion has been allowed >> >to escalate no differently than the Special Project issue. >> >> Whoa, Bill!! Why do you think this is a split into sides on the vote for a >> secretary??? One of the reasons I wanted to keep the vote private was to keep >> it from becoming just that. Do you see my vote for Tim as a vote AGAINST >> you??? Heaven forbid!!! I can work with you if you win the same as I can >> work >> with Tim. I guess my nominating Tim was my statement that I don't see the >> need >> for a secretary. Tim has been told so much that he CAN'T do that I just don't >> see why he can't handle tracking the votes. If the rest of the board >> disagrees >> with me, so be it. I have been on the losing side of a vote before and I >> don't >> believe I hold a grudge. >> >> Can YOU work with Tim if you win??? I certainly hope so and believe that you >> can. It is my feeling that as secretary you should PRIVATELY help Tim if he >> has a question about PPP. You are very good on that subject and so you should >> be helping Tim learn the ropes, not waiting till he falls through them and >> then >> pointing out where he messed up. >> >> I am only on the side of the USGenWeb Project. >> >> Thanks for listening. >> Betsy > >Betsy, > >Didn't mean to offend you [or anyone], just stating some things as I see them. >There were three posts sitting in Draft mode, waiting for me to either rewrite >them or send them [I do try to follow my own rules]. One I just sent out which >contains the generally accepted views on positions in any organization. That >post, plus my answer to Yvonne's post [still sitting in Draft mode], should have >preceded the one which you just answered. [The latter one probably won't get sent >-- obvious reasons] > >It is still my gut feeling that there is a perception of competition. I'm pleased >to back down in at least your case. For those that know me well, know that I am >an action person. Spinning wheels doesn't sit well with me. I'd rather make a >mistake than sit on my hands. Due to this trait I lead, I am a leader, in the >absence of leadership, I will lead. As you have already experienced, that does >not mean people blindly follow or follow at all. If folk don't follow I'll keep >throwing things out there until something allow conclusion. > >One further point, I haven't seen any vote for Tim as a vote "against" me. Votes >are an expression of personal evaluations of situations [I hope]. A person >interpreting my actions as competing for leadership would fall into the category >"of contributing to the lack of consensus on leadership". > >Yes, I can work with Tim. Yes, I can help him. And, have attempted to do so >privately. I'm am not always correct, that's a fact. The NC puts his own boots >on. If he asks for help he gets it. Otherwise he is corrected if necessary. No >differently than you just did for me. [and no offense has been taken] > >My experience is some fifty years of organizations of many types, public service >type, societies, and corporations. My only objection to Tim being secretary is >not personal it positional. He is the Chair. As for counting votes, I'm sure he >is capable, and I don't believe that was the point. > >My thoughts were that a secretary would be of help to the NC's position and in my >case, it would put us in closer communications which could only help facilitate >things, not usurp authority. Take that for what you will. > >Sincerely, > >Bill >-- > >P.S. Thanks for the compliment(s). > ------=_NextPart_000_01C1_01BF7D2F.E6D1B060-- [xxxxxxx] Tue Feb 22 13:26:49 2000 [xxxxxxx] Received: from mail1.radix.net (mail1.radix.net [207.192.128.31]) by saltmine.radix.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA15468 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:26:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from [xxxxxx] ([xxxxxx] [199.184.119.1]) by mail1.radix.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA22340 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:26:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (nei-pm2-018.inetnebr.com [206.222.223.92]) by [xxxxxx] (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA18952; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:26:41 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <01d101bf7d62$490fc320$5cdfdece@default> [xxxxxxx] To: "merope" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:26:05 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_01CE_01BF7D2F.FE6C2B60" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01CE_01BF7D2F.FE6C2B60 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------=_NextPart_000_01CE_01BF7D2F.FE6C2B60 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Explain to me please (10).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Explain to me please (10).eml" Return-Path: Received: from u2.farm.idt.net (root@u2.farm.idt.net [169.132.8.11]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA19857 [xxxxxx] Sat, 27 Feb 1999 09:43:30 -0600 (CST) Received: from idt.net (ppp-19.ts-1.dc.idt.net [169.132.20.163]) by u2.farm.idt.net (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA20079; Sat, 27 Feb 1999 10:43:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <36D8136D.39431000@idt.net> Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 10:46:53 -0500 From: Yvonne James-Henderson Organization: Visit Daisy's Roots! http://www.rootsweb.com/~daisy/1daisy.htm X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: jpowelljr CC: Linda Lewis , Bridgett Smith , bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, Yvonne James-Henderson Subject: Re: Explain to me please References: <199902261949.LAA08982@jubjub.wizard.com> <36D70593.5CF9@ix.netcom.com> <36D8011C.76389A05@worldnet.att.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: d2b9da50e058de960d249761a2d80cd9 I don't believe you people! What in the world did Linda do?? She started a wonderful repository for raw information, she gave us strict guidelines, that we all adhered to, to make this a comprehensive and cohesive digital library. A real open family atmosphere. And this the thanks she gets? Jim wrote: (I do detect a "sour grapes" complex pushing this issue). Excuse me, Linda did not sneak off with the Archives and Archives volunteers, I think you have it turned around here. I have tried to keep quiet about this, but it is so ridiculous. She has a REAL complaint here and not one of you addressed her complaint, but were quick to take sides and label Linda a troublemaker. If you have a problem with your town librarian, do you go in and steal all the books and put them somewhere else? I don't think so! Although maybe you do..... I am ashamed to call myself a board member, with your secret mIrc meetings, yes, we know who you are and all of this Linda bashing. It disgusts me! Yvonne in Burke, VA Vive la USGenWeb Project! ************************** ------=_NextPart_000_01CE_01BF7D2F.FE6C2B60 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Explain to me please (11).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Explain to me please (11).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc07.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc07.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.42]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA22579 [xxxxxx] Sat, 27 Feb 1999 09:59:41 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.76.100.60]) by mtiwmhc07.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990227155909.FPKM8225@worldnet.att.net>; Sat, 27 Feb 1999 15:59:09 +0000 Message-ID: <36D81605.F80D6DC3@worldnet.att.net> Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 10:57:58 -0500 From: William N Oliver Reply-To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net Organization: NEGenWeb/OHGenWeb/USGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,nl,de-CH,de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: jpowelljr CC: Linda Lewis , Bridgett Smith , bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net Subject: Re: Explain to me please References: <199902261949.LAA08982@jubjub.wizard.com> <36D70593.5CF9@ix.netcom.com> <36D8011C.76389A05@worldnet.att.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 21a9d88946f91c3298c52655cc58a434 jpowelljr wrote: > Linda and Kay... At this point I respect both of you for > what you have done for online Genealogy and what you can do > in the future. I hope that the two of you can find common > ground here. The only real concern that Linda can come up > with is the fact that the Census Project does not directly > place transcriptions in the "proper" directory. (I do detect > a "sour grapes" complex pushing this issue). Would it be a > problem to state on the Census Project Pages that "All > transcriptions will be stored as part of the Census Project > and a copy will be sent to the Archives to be included in > the Project's Digital Library" > Now for all of the above to have any meaning at all the > Archives must reaffirm their support of USGenWeb and their > intention to remain a part of USGenWeb as long as USGenWeb > exists as Project promoting Free Online Genealogical > Resources. > Please be careful Linda, I have sent a lot of data to the > Archives with the understanding that the Archives were an > integral part of USGenWeb. If that was a misunderstanding > based on information from representatives of the Archives, I > just might want my data back, and USGenWeb just might have > need of their own Digital Library. > After a moment of reflection, I guess what is bothering me > about Linda's words of late is how directly they oppose what > submitters are told. I was told all about how the USGenWeb > Archives was set up as part of USGenWeb and was a forever > type thing, when I resisted send in items at first. When I > volunteered to upload the Henderson County, KY Archives, I > was told that it was all part of the same thing and it was > tied to my county there. I was told there were 3 > directories for Henderson County, the HTML directory where > my pages are stored, the ftp directory where the > transcriptions are stored and the TOC, directory where the > table of contents resided. Now it seems like I'm being told > that the Archives have only been along for the ride and at > any time they may leave. What would the majority of the > submitters think about that? > Respectfully, > Jim Jim, you once said that we were not far apart in our thinking. Well, I've an announcement for you [in great and broad humor] -- "I hate it when you are RIGHT!" It has such humorous interpretations and my family uses it quite often. Your take on the above situation seems astute and forward looking. Further, your take seems to say unlock us from the pre-BLs and lets push on to the future frontiers. To grow we should all prepare for the future, for whether we like it or not, the future always means "change". WE, the AB, are responsible for looking down the road as far as our imaginations will allow. The concern that any archives is not a part of USGWP is certainly scar[e]y. Again our AB responsibility to see that it doesn't happen. Sincerely, Bill -- ------=_NextPart_000_01CE_01BF7D2F.FE6C2B60 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Explain to me please (12).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Explain to me please (12).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.networkone.net (root@mail.networkone.net [209.144.112.75]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA18325 [xxxxxx] Sat, 27 Feb 1999 12:11:25 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (assured-01-114.ln.networkone.net [209.144.118.115]) by mail.networkone.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id KAA04451; Sat, 27 Feb 1999 10:10:57 -0800 Message-Id: <199902271810.KAA04451@mail.networkone.net> From: "Kay Mason" To: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Kay Mason , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Bill Oliver , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , Linda Russell Lewis , Betsy Mills Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 10:07:54 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Explain to me please Reply-to: kmfkm@ptw.com Priority: normal In-reply-to: <36D8011C.76389A05@worldnet.att.net> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT X-UIDL: ae2d9cf79aec03b9c7b33f6e3baf9a71 Jim, The main page of the Census Project says... The USGenWeb Census Project is a part of USGenWeb Project Archives and providing free online research data for everyone is our goal. All transcriptions are being uploaded to the USGenWeb Census Project Archives and the USGenWeb Archives. Kay Date sent: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 09:28:44 -0500 From: jpowelljr To: Linda Lewis Copies to: Bridgett Smith , bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net Subject: Re: Explain to me please > Linda and Kay... At this point I respect both of you for > what you have done for online Genealogy and what you can do > in the future. I hope that the two of you can find common > ground here. The only real concern that Linda can come up > with is the fact that the Census Project does not directly > place transcriptions in the "proper" directory. (I do detect > a "sour grapes" complex pushing this issue). Would it be a > problem to state on the Census Project Pages that "All > transcriptions will be stored as part of the Census Project > and a copy will be sent to the Archives to be included in > the Project's Digital Library" > Now for all of the above to have any meaning at all the > Archives must reaffirm their support of USGenWeb and their > intention to remain a part of USGenWeb as long as USGenWeb > exists as Project promoting Free Online Genealogical > Resources. > Please be careful Linda, I have sent a lot of data to the > Archives with the understanding that the Archives were an > integral part of USGenWeb. If that was a misunderstanding > based on information from representatives of the Archives, I > just might want my data back, and USGenWeb just might have > need of their own Digital Library. > After a moment of reflection, I guess what is bothering me > about Linda's words of late is how directly they oppose what > submitters are told. I was told all about how the USGenWeb > Archives was set up as part of USGenWeb and was a forever > type thing, when I resisted send in items at first. When I > volunteered to upload the Henderson County, KY Archives, I > was told that it was all part of the same thing and it was > tied to my county there. I was told there were 3 > directories for Henderson County, the HTML directory where > my pages are stored, the ftp directory where the > transcriptions are stored and the TOC, directory where the > table of contents resided. Now it seems like I'm being told > that the Archives have only been along for the ride and at > any time they may leave. What would the majority of the > submitters think about that? > Respectfully, > Jim > USGenWeb Census Project http://www.usgenweb.org/census/ http://www.usgenweb.com/census http://www.usgenweb.net/census/ Montgomery County Mississippi http://www.rootsweb.com/~msmontgo/ Rock County Nebraska http://www.rootsweb.com/~nerock/ ------=_NextPart_000_01CE_01BF7D2F.FE6C2B60 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Explain to me please (13).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Explain to me please (13).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc06.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc06.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.41]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA09733 [xxxxxx] Sat, 27 Feb 1999 14:09:10 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.67.146.140]) by mtiwmhc06.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990227200838.WNX28655@worldnet.att.net>; Sat, 27 Feb 1999 20:08:38 +0000 Message-ID: <36D85081.E596A3AB@worldnet.att.net> Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 15:07:30 -0500 From: William N Oliver Reply-To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net Organization: NEGenWeb/OHGenWeb/USGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,nl,de-CH,de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: jpowelljr CC: Linda Lewis , Bridgett Smith , bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net Subject: Re: Explain to me please References: <199902261949.LAA08982@jubjub.wizard.com> <36D70593.5CF9@ix.netcom.com> <36D8011C.76389A05@worldnet.att.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 15fa50f656f019c1fcfaf05867de814d jpowelljr wrote: > Linda and Kay... At this point I respect both of you for > what you have done for online Genealogy and what you can do > in the future. I hope that the two of you can find common ============== cut ===========> > that the Archives have only been along for the ride and at > any time they may leave. What would the majority of the > submitters think about that? > Respectfully, > Jim Less an answer to Jim's post and more a take on a situation. Without the benefit of more than available posts to this board and statements on the USGWP pages, these are my limited views. There appears to be three facets to the ideas concerning Special Projects of the USGWP. First is a Pre-ByLaws historical facet. Second is the Post-ByLaws facet. And, thirdly, and by far the most important, the Future facet. My take is that to reach and guide for the future one needs to know the past and its place, but must be imaginative in the present to prepare a sensible future. This cannot be done by inflexible maintenance of the past. The By-Laws, it seems, tried to address that issue, however weakly, by giving credence to separating the then three major Special Projects. And, these ARE Special Projects of the USGWP. It certainly needs to be brought into the usgenweb.org domain. That has to be dealt with yet at some point. Aside, I wonder, with our inability to get things done who will support the above move. Who trusts us? Parliamentary Authorities support the idea that an organization needs two positions to function; a Chair and a Secretary. All other positions are convenience. Thank goodness that not many people are interested enough to follow the Board-L postings. There has been criticism that RW wants to keep the Archives in their domain. If my employer was RW I would also agree with that ... USGWP is too unstable to be trusted with their own mission: "... a group of volunteers working together to provide Internet websites or genealogical research in every county and every state of the United States, the Project is non-commercial and fully committed to free access for everyone." ------=_NextPart_000_01CE_01BF7D2F.FE6C2B60 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Explain to me please (14).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Explain to me please (14).eml" Return-Path: Received: from dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.4]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA12570 [xxxxxx] Sun, 28 Feb 1999 17:20:27 -0600 (CST) From: cityslic@ix.netcom.com Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id RAA15721; Sun, 28 Feb 1999 17:16:31 -0600 (CST) Received: from tfx-us5-12.ix.netcom.com(204.30.67.172) by dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma015577; Sun Feb 28 17:15:39 1999 Message-ID: <36D9C86A.7AA2@ix.netcom.com> Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 17:51:22 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-NC320 (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net CC: jpowelljr , Bridgett Smith , bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net Subject: Re: Explain to me please References: <199902261949.LAA08982@jubjub.wizard.com> <36D70593.5CF9@ix.netcom.com> <36D8011C.76389A05@worldnet.att.net> <36D85081.E596A3AB@worldnet.att.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 22eecec74c0604e1bfd9a405977b474e I will state again.. and please make a note of this and remember it when I'm accused of "me" or whatever. Kay has done a great job of recruiting and training volunteers for a special project. The files uploaded to the USGenWeb Archives must follow the strict guidelines in place. The track record of the USGenWeb Archives stands. Thank you, Linda ------=_NextPart_000_01CE_01BF7D2F.FE6C2B60 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Explain to me please (15).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Explain to me please (15).eml" Return-Path: Received: from imo26.mx.aol.com (imo26.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.70]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id FAA05235 [xxxxxx] Mon, 1 Mar 1999 05:29:40 -0600 (CST) From: FEATHER2s@aol.com Received: from FEATHER2s@aol.com by imo26.mx.aol.com (IMOv18.1) id DUCTa00804; Mon, 1 Mar 1999 06:23:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 06:23:49 EST To: cityslic@ix.netcom.com Cc: bascs@snark.wizard.com, bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Explain to me please Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 205 X-UIDL: bb25f0379628b273747e0a50bd1aa669 In a message dated 2/26/99 9:07:04 PM Eastern Standard Time, Linda wrote: >> Are you now informing the Advisory Board that you intend to remain in non- >> compliance until such time as the Advisory Board choses to issue a statement >> that adheres to your wishes stated above? > How can the USGenWeb Archives duplicate something they were already >doing? The USGenWeb Census Project apparently started in September 1998. >The USGenWeb Archives Census Project started in February 1997. > We are not duplicating.. only continuing what we started. Linda >> You have eloquently evaded my question, so I am restating in simpler terms: Do you intend to remain in non-compliance with the Advisory Board's published Statement until such time as the Advisory Board issues a Statement in accordance with your wishes? This is a question I think we all deserve a simple, direct answer to. Thanks, Ginger ------=_NextPart_000_01CE_01BF7D2F.FE6C2B60-- [xxxxxxx] Tue Feb 22 13:27:26 2000 [xxxxxxx] Received: from mail1.radix.net (mail1.radix.net [207.192.128.31]) by saltmine.radix.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA15532 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:27:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from [xxxxxx] ([xxxxxx] [199.184.119.1]) by mail1.radix.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA22463 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:27:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (nei-pm2-018.inetnebr.com [206.222.223.92]) by [xxxxxx] (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA19243; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:27:16 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <01de01bf7d62$5dd0df60$5cdfdece@default> [xxxxxxx] To: "merope" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:26:40 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_01DB_01BF7D30.13366F60" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01DB_01BF7D30.13366F60 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------=_NextPart_000_01DB_01BF7D30.13366F60 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Explain to me please (2).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Explain to me please (2).eml" Return-Path: Received: from dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.3]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA14555 [xxxxxx] Fri, 26 Feb 1999 14:49:26 -0600 (CST) Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id OAA26607; Fri, 26 Feb 1999 14:46:25 -0600 (CST) Received: from irv-ca48-13.ix.netcom.com(207.94.85.13) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma026543; Fri Feb 26 14:45:45 1999 Message-ID: <36D70765.975@ix.netcom.com> Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 12:43:17 -0800 From: Linda Lewis Organization: USGenWeb Archives, VAGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-NC320 (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bridgett Smith CC: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net Subject: Re: Explain to me please References: <199902261949.LAA08982@jubjub.wizard.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 3d21aaf53969c08dc6c2b820832c427f Bridgett Smith wrote: > > WHAT is the relationship of the USGenWeb Project Archives and > the USGW Project Census Project? Is there no connection > anymore? Has that been a finalized split, or what? > Apparently, yes. You'll have to ask Kay why. File managers were asking me those same questions a few months ago. I had hoped for a solution to the problem months ago, but (even though I was being encouraged to "work things out" by several folks) Kay has refused to discuss it with me for months. The USGenWeb Archives will still maintain the original USGenWeb Archives Census Project, just as we will the USGenWeb Archives Pension Project, and whatever else comes along... to get data online in a permanent repository. Linda ------=_NextPart_000_01DB_01BF7D30.13366F60 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Explain to me please (3).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Explain to me please (3).eml" Return-Path: Received: from dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.3]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA26508 [xxxxxx] Fri, 26 Feb 1999 15:34:50 -0600 (CST) Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id PAA04145; Fri, 26 Feb 1999 15:31:16 -0600 (CST) Received: from irv-ca48-13.ix.netcom.com(207.94.85.13) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma004096; Fri Feb 26 15:31:05 1999 Message-ID: <36D711F3.64DC@ix.netcom.com> Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 13:28:19 -0800 From: Linda Lewis Organization: USGenWeb Archives, VAGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-NC320 (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bridgett Smith CC: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net Subject: Re: Explain to me please References: <199902261949.LAA08982@jubjub.wizard.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 6fb0bb60323b3db45e7f3b8bb44ec676 The following has been on the front page of the USGenWeb Archives since July 1996. Nothing has changed. "The USGenWeb Digital Library (Archives) was developed to present actual transcriptions of public domain records on the Internet. This huge undertaking is the cooperative effort of volunteers who either have electronically formatted files on census records, marriage bonds, wills, and other public documents, or are willing to transcribe this information to contribute. Once the decision was made to develop a project, originally called "TimeToDo" Something, a call went out to volunteers who would be willing to transcribe primary records as a service to the Internet genealogical community, find a way to get them posted on the Internet, and allow the USGenWeb county hosts to store large files in a central location with a search engine. Space is donated by RootsWeb for storage of the files. The table above is broken down by state. The left column represents the location of a table of contents for each state, with a brief description of each file and a direct link to it.The right column is the actual location of the archived files. The USGenWeb Archives Digital Library was implemented in July 1996, and files are being added everyday. If you have transcriptions to contribute, please contact the person listed on the state table of contents page. Please read the Guidelines for file contributions. The files need to be in ascii text format, and will be converted by the state archive manager if in another form." There is over a gig of data (text files, not counting scans of actual documents including census microfilm, marriage bonds, tombstones, etc.) in the Archives. Linda ------=_NextPart_000_01DB_01BF7D30.13366F60 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Explain to me please (4).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Explain to me please (4).eml" Return-Path: Received: from jubjub.wizard.com (jubjub.wizard.com [199.171.28.9]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA23248 [xxxxxx] Fri, 26 Feb 1999 18:55:43 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (pm2-1-089.wizard.com [208.211.48.89]) by jubjub.wizard.com (8.9.2/8.9.0) with SMTP id QAA03829; Fri, 26 Feb 1999 16:54:51 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199902270054.QAA03829@jubjub.wizard.com> From: "Bridgett Smith" To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 16:54:24 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Explain to me please Priority: normal In-reply-to: <36D70593.5CF9@ix.netcom.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) X-UIDL: 0e24955b60a6dda960f4d1694de7a1f7 On 26 Feb 99, at 12:35, Linda Lewis wrote: > First of all.. I don't think it's my place to respond to members of the > Board about Archives business, unless they ask me directly. Since Bridgett > was commenting on my message to the usgenweb-se list, I answered here. Does this mean that a project that has USGenWeb in it's name is none of our collective business? I put this conversation in with the same way I would with individual state business. Internal state business is just that internal, to be kept there, HOWEVER, when it seeps over into everyone's business by a questionable post (meaning not understanding the post) on a mailing list, and the questionable part has to do with just implemented board policy then I think you have every right and should talk about the business of the archives pertaining to the question. > > The USGenWeb Archives have strict guidelines concerning files uploaded > there and *part of* the Archives. > > The USGenWeb Archives is not "owned" by USGenWeb. Guess were going to go to splitting hairs here. I will try to explain what I meant by owned. The submitters still own their data, but that doesn't make them own (the site this data is uploaded to) the Digital Library. >It was still going to be a support project for county coordinators, >but I had to obtain permission from the then national coordinator to >use the name "USGenWeb." Are the Archives a part of the USGenWeb project, or are they just allowed to use the USGenWeb name? What you just describe above is no more than what GenConnect is at this time, but they didn't ask to use nor do they use the organizational name. > > > A file submitted, for instance to a county coordinator only, for > > uploading to their site, is not part of the USGenWeb Archives. Files > > residing on other servers or even on Rootsweb, but not in the > >above directories, are not part of the USGenWeb Archives. > > How is that statement misleading? Go tell hundreds of county > coordinators that files they've uploaded to their site are part of the > USGenWeb Archives... see what they say! > Misleading in the context and response to the message that it evolved from -- the statement made by the Board regarding the Census Project. i.e., if you send data to the Census Project then there is no guarantees that it will be not be sold and or fees charged to obtain the information as it is located on another server than the 2 you listed. Taken out of context and away from the message that it evolved from, then yes I can see where you wouldn't understand where I am coming from regarding misleading. > Sue Baker *is* notifying the file managers when census transcriptions are > uploaded elsewhere, and if the submitter has agreed that the file be *in* > the USGenWeb Archives also, the file managers copy the file and upload it > to the appropriate directory. That is not what I asked, what I asked is if any transcriptions were submitted to the archives directly is the Census Project being notified? I also noticed that the "USGenWeb Archives Census Project" is still asking for transcribers -- which is in direct violation of our statement. Will this be taken care of shortly? Thanks, Bridgett Bridgett Smith SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region bascs@wizard.com *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* TNGenWeb State Coordinator http://www.tngenweb.org/ ------=_NextPart_000_01DB_01BF7D30.13366F60 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Explain to me please (5).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Explain to me please (5).eml" Return-Path: Received: from jubjub.wizard.com (jubjub.wizard.com [199.171.28.9]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA25423 [xxxxxx] Fri, 26 Feb 1999 19:05:56 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (pm2-1-089.wizard.com [208.211.48.89]) by jubjub.wizard.com (8.9.2/8.9.0) with SMTP id RAA05131; Fri, 26 Feb 1999 17:05:11 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199902270105.RAA05131@jubjub.wizard.com> From: "Bridgett Smith" To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, cityslic@ix.netcom.com Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 17:04:49 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Explain to me please Priority: normal In-reply-to: <36D70765.975@ix.netcom.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) X-UIDL: 4e85e694180be23f5576b1692869c2cb On 26 Feb 99, at 12:43, Linda Lewis wrote: > Bridgett Smith wrote: > > > > WHAT is the relationship of the USGenWeb Project Archives and > > the USGW Project Census Project? Is there no connection > > anymore? Has that been a finalized split, or what? > > > > Apparently, yes. You'll have to ask Kay why. File managers were asking me > those same questions a few months ago. I had hoped for a solution to the > problem months ago, but (even though I was being encouraged to "work > things out" by several folks) Kay has refused to discuss it with me for > months. Okay Kay, it's your turn. > > The USGenWeb Archives will still maintain the original USGenWeb Archives > Census Project, just as we will the USGenWeb Archives Pension Project, and > whatever else comes along... to get data online in a permanent repository. > Maintain original USGenWeb ARchives Census Project, including the recruitment of transcribers, which is going against the Advisory Board Official statement regarding that they should not actively seek them? Bridget Bridgett Smith SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region bascs@wizard.com *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* TNGenWeb State Coordinator http://www.tngenweb.org/ ------=_NextPart_000_01DB_01BF7D30.13366F60 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Explain to me please (6).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Explain to me please (6).eml" Return-Path: Received: from dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.7]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA29650 [xxxxxx] Fri, 26 Feb 1999 19:27:37 -0600 (CST) Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id TAA10098; Fri, 26 Feb 1999 19:24:29 -0600 (CST) Received: from irv-ca48-51.ix.netcom.com(207.94.85.51) by dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma010012; Fri Feb 26 19:24:03 1999 Message-ID: <36D7488D.152E@ix.netcom.com> Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 17:21:17 -0800 From: Linda Lewis Organization: USGenWeb Archives, VAGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-NC320 (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bridgett Smith CC: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net Subject: Re: Explain to me please References: <199902270054.QAA03829@jubjub.wizard.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 421cfa2c007dd1b29e92a3d19e6ab3f1 Bridgett Smith wrote: > > On 26 Feb 99, at 12:35, Linda Lewis wrote: > > > First of all.. I don't think it's my place to respond to members of the > > Board about Archives business, unless they ask me directly. Since Bridgett > > was commenting on my message to the usgenweb-se list, I answered here. > > Does this mean that a project that has USGenWeb in it's name is > none of our collective business? > What I meant by that.. is that I am not the Archives rep on this Board.. and only replied because my message to the usgenweb-se list was being discussed, and Jan, the Archives rep, cannot read my mind.. at least not all the time. > > >It was still going to be a support project for county coordinators, > >but I had to obtain permission from the then national coordinator to > >use the name "USGenWeb." > > Are the Archives a part of the USGenWeb project, or are they just > allowed to use the USGenWeb name? What you just describe above > is no more than what GenConnect is at this time, but they didn't ask > to use nor do they use the organizational name. > I guess they are still a part of The USGenWeb Project, until the majority of the volunteers vote that they are not. > > > > Misleading in the context and response to the message that it > evolved from -- the statement made by the Board regarding the > Census Project. i.e., if you send data to the Census Project then > there is no guarantees that it will be not be sold and or fees charged > to obtain the information as it is located on another server than the 2 > you listed. Taken out of context and away from the message that it > evolved from, then yes I can see where you wouldn't understand > where I am coming from regarding misleading. > I stand by that... we at the Archives cannot guarantee the census files being uploaded elsewhere will not move to a Russian server, Broderbund, or anywhere else. > > Sue Baker *is* notifying the file managers when census transcriptions are > > uploaded elsewhere, and if the submitter has agreed that the file be *in* > > the USGenWeb Archives also, the file managers copy the file and upload it > > to the appropriate directory. > > That is not what I asked, what I asked is if any transcriptions were > submitted to the archives directly is the Census Project being > notified? > The census project was created to standardize census transcriptions. I don't think the USGenWeb Census Project is interested in every partial census file that is uploaded to the USGenWeb Archives. If the submitter wishes to submit their file to 100 sites, that's their choice. We do not submit files to other sites, as we are only responsible for files in the Archives, and very publicly state what the purpose is. We have not copied or moved files to another site, which would be a blatant disregard to the agreement we have with file submitters. > I also noticed that the "USGenWeb Archives Census Project" is still > asking for transcribers -- which is in direct violation of our > statement. Will this be taken care of shortly? > I notice the USGenWeb Census Project still has a separate archives. When that violation is taken care of, the coordinator of the USGenWeb Archives Census Project will work with the coordinator of the USGenWeb Census Project in making any changes. The USGenWeb Archives will continue to recruit transcribers for any and all records. Are you saying the USGenWeb Archives should not recruit volunteers for data.. or only not recruit for census data? What will be next? Obits? Newspaper articles? Biographies? Wills? Land grants? Deeds? Cemeteries? Bibles? > Thanks, > > Bridgett > Bridgett Smith > SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region > > bascs@wizard.com > Thank you! :) Linda ------=_NextPart_000_01DB_01BF7D30.13366F60 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Explain to me please (7).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Explain to me please (7).eml" Return-Path: Received: from imo28.mx.aol.com (imo28.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.72]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA05214 [xxxxxx] Fri, 26 Feb 1999 19:58:06 -0600 (CST) From: FEATHER2s@aol.com Received: from FEATHER2s@aol.com by imo28.mx.aol.com (IMOv19.3) id uZUCa02500; Fri, 26 Feb 1999 20:47:09 +1900 (EST) Message-ID: <9d5a3179.36d74e9d@aol.com> Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 20:47:09 EST To: cityslic@ix.netcom.com, bascs@snark.wizard.com Cc: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Explain to me please Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 205 X-UIDL: 64b3cbc743a3d0c0bba91b08265865fb Linda, << I notice the USGenWeb Census Project still has a separate archives. When that violation is taken care of, the coordinator of the USGenWeb Archives Census Project will work with the coordinator of the USGenWeb Census Project in making any changes. The USGenWeb Archives will continue to recruit transcribers for any and all records. >> The Advisory Borad has issued no statement, nor passed any Motion stating the Census Project cannot have separate archives. We have, however, issued a statement about the Archives duplicating the Census Project's efforts and soliciting volunteers for this effort. Are you now informing the Advisory Board that you intend to remain in non- compliance until such time as the Advisory Board choses to issue a statement that adheres to your wishes stated above? Ginger ------=_NextPart_000_01DB_01BF7D30.13366F60-- [xxxxxxx] Tue Feb 22 13:27:55 2000 [xxxxxxx] Received: from mail1.radix.net (mail1.radix.net [207.192.128.31]) by saltmine.radix.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA15565 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:27:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from [xxxxxx] ([xxxxxx] [199.184.119.1]) by mail1.radix.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA22528 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:27:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (nei-pm2-018.inetnebr.com [206.222.223.92]) by [xxxxxx] (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA19498; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:27:47 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <01e901bf7d62$70820760$5cdfdece@default> [xxxxxxx] To: "merope" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:27:11 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_01E6_01BF7D30.25E79760" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01E6_01BF7D30.25E79760 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------=_NextPart_000_01E6_01BF7D30.25E79760 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Explain to me please (8).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Explain to me please (8).eml" Return-Path: Received: from dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.7]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA07490 [xxxxxx] Fri, 26 Feb 1999 20:10:14 -0600 (CST) Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id UAA15083; Fri, 26 Feb 1999 20:06:52 -0600 (CST) Received: from irv-ca48-51.ix.netcom.com(207.94.85.51) by dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma015042; Fri Feb 26 20:06:39 1999 Message-ID: <36D75284.45D3@ix.netcom.com> Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 18:03:48 -0800 From: Linda Lewis Organization: USGenWeb Archives, VAGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-NC320 (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: FEATHER2s@aol.com CC: bascs@snark.wizard.com, bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net Subject: Re: Explain to me please References: <9d5a3179.36d74e9d@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 186e13886c7336b120149a77210c43ba FEATHER2s@aol.com wrote: > > Linda, > > << I notice the USGenWeb Census Project still has a separate archives. When > that violation is taken care of, the coordinator of the USGenWeb > Archives Census Project will work with the coordinator of the USGenWeb > Census Project in making any changes. The USGenWeb Archives will > continue to recruit transcribers for any and all records. >> > > The Advisory Borad has issued no statement, nor passed any Motion stating the > Census Project cannot have separate archives. We have, however, issued a > statement about the Archives duplicating the Census Project's efforts and > soliciting volunteers for this effort. > > Are you now informing the Advisory Board that you intend to remain in non- > compliance until such time as the Advisory Board choses to issue a statement > that adheres to your wishes stated above? > > Ginger How can the USGenWeb Archives duplicate something they were already doing? The USGenWeb Census Project apparently started in September 1998. The USGenWeb Archives Census Project started in February 1997. We are not duplicating.. only continuing what we started. Linda ------=_NextPart_000_01E6_01BF7D30.25E79760 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Explain to me please (9).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Explain to me please (9).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc06.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc06.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.41]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA07899 [xxxxxx] Sat, 27 Feb 1999 08:28:10 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.70.18.196]) by mtiwmhc06.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990227142738.MNI9374@worldnet.att.net>; Sat, 27 Feb 1999 14:27:38 +0000 Message-ID: <36D8011C.76389A05@worldnet.att.net> Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 09:28:44 -0500 From: jpowelljr X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Linda Lewis CC: Bridgett Smith , bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net Subject: Re: Explain to me please References: <199902261949.LAA08982@jubjub.wizard.com> <36D70593.5CF9@ix.netcom.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 063a0fb0a05332696fadade21b47f3bd Linda and Kay... At this point I respect both of you for what you have done for online Genealogy and what you can do in the future. I hope that the two of you can find common ground here. The only real concern that Linda can come up with is the fact that the Census Project does not directly place transcriptions in the "proper" directory. (I do detect a "sour grapes" complex pushing this issue). Would it be a problem to state on the Census Project Pages that "All transcriptions will be stored as part of the Census Project and a copy will be sent to the Archives to be included in the Project's Digital Library" Now for all of the above to have any meaning at all the Archives must reaffirm their support of USGenWeb and their intention to remain a part of USGenWeb as long as USGenWeb exists as Project promoting Free Online Genealogical Resources. Please be careful Linda, I have sent a lot of data to the Archives with the understanding that the Archives were an integral part of USGenWeb. If that was a misunderstanding based on information from representatives of the Archives, I just might want my data back, and USGenWeb just might have need of their own Digital Library. After a moment of reflection, I guess what is bothering me about Linda's words of late is how directly they oppose what submitters are told. I was told all about how the USGenWeb Archives was set up as part of USGenWeb and was a forever type thing, when I resisted send in items at first. When I volunteered to upload the Henderson County, KY Archives, I was told that it was all part of the same thing and it was tied to my county there. I was told there were 3 directories for Henderson County, the HTML directory where my pages are stored, the ftp directory where the transcriptions are stored and the TOC, directory where the table of contents resided. Now it seems like I'm being told that the Archives have only been along for the ride and at any time they may leave. What would the majority of the submitters think about that? Respectfully, Jim ------=_NextPart_000_01E6_01BF7D30.25E79760 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Explain to me please.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Explain to me please.eml" Return-Path: Received: from dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.3]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA12931 [xxxxxx] Fri, 26 Feb 1999 14:42:23 -0600 (CST) Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id OAA25484; Fri, 26 Feb 1999 14:38:27 -0600 (CST) Received: from irv-ca48-13.ix.netcom.com(207.94.85.13) by dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma025440; Fri Feb 26 14:38:19 1999 Message-ID: <36D70593.5CF9@ix.netcom.com> Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 12:35:31 -0800 From: Linda Lewis Organization: USGenWeb Archives, VAGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-NC320 (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bridgett Smith CC: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net Subject: Re: Explain to me please References: <199902261949.LAA08982@jubjub.wizard.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 5dced9d38dfd546117bf78d6e01a7793 First of all.. I don't think it's my place to respond to members of the Board about Archives business, unless they ask me directly. Since Bridgett was commenting on my message to the usgenweb-se list, I answered here. The USGenWeb Archives have strict guidelines concerning files uploaded there and *part of* the Archives. The USGenWeb Archives is not "owned" by USGenWeb. It is a project started to support the county coordinators, back when people only had 2 megs of space from their ISP. It does not belong to anyone except the submitters, who have agreed to allow their files be stored there permanently as long as there is free access. A few hours before the announcement about the Archives went out in July 1996, it was almost named the Rootsweb Archives, but with the same goals and strict guidelines. It was still going to be a support project for county coordinators, but I had to obtain permission from the then national coordinator to use the name "USGenWeb." > A file submitted, for instance to a county coordinator only, for > uploading to their site, is not part of the USGenWeb Archives. Files > residing on other servers or even on Rootsweb, but not in the >above directories, are not part of the USGenWeb Archives. How is that statement misleading? Go tell hundreds of county coordinators that files they've uploaded to their site are part of the USGenWeb Archives... see what they say! Sue Baker *is* notifying the file managers when census transcriptions are uploaded elsewhere, and if the submitter has agreed that the file be *in* the USGenWeb Archives also, the file managers copy the file and upload it to the appropriate directory. On February 15, 1999, S-K Publications notified us that they would continue providing free books to census transcribers as long as the transcriptions would be uploaded to both Archives, the USGenWeb Archives and the USGenWen Census Archives. Up until then, the books were donated for the files to be uploaded to the USGenWeb Archives. The other archives didn't exist. Linda ------=_NextPart_000_01E6_01BF7D30.25E79760 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re How much is enough.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re How much is enough.eml" Return-Path: Received: from staff2.cso.uiuc.edu (root@staff2.cso.uiuc.edu [128.174.5.53]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA17236 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 21:54:19 -0600 (CST) Received: from [130.126.26.69] (london-9.slip.uiuc.edu [130.126.26.69]) by staff2.cso.uiuc.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA06320; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 21:53:13 -0600 (CST) X-Sender: cgsnyder@staff.uiuc.edu Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <01be5a28$83bc4ce0$35bb8ecf@default> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 21:55:46 -0600 To: "Beth Wills" From: "Celia G. Snyder" Subject: Re: How much is enough Cc: "Yvonne James-Henderson" , "Trey Holt" , "Tim Stowell" , "Megan Zurawicz" , "Lynn Watermann" , "Kim Harris Myers" , "Jim Powell" , "Ginger Cisewski" , "Bridgett" , "Bonnie McVicar Briggs" , "Bill Oliver" , "Betsy" , "Kay Mason" , "Jan Craven" X-UIDL: 37a2e8378db951d62733b2a47334e9fd Beth, Have you received any messages today? I went through the website pretty carefully last night and I think I got most, if not all, of the email links changed. Celia At 10:49 PM -0500 2/16/99, Beth Wills wrote: >Okay ! For those of you who have indicated that I PROMISED to stick this >out through thick and thin.....We have got to get things on track. I am >going nuts here trying to figure out what is going on, who's on first, etc. >And, I think that I have walked on egg shells long enough. There is >currently a motion on Board-L that has been seconded. Any board member can >call a motion and call for a vote. Now lets get down to business and >vote so that we can get the rest of this mess cleaned up. >Beth >P.S. I don't know how many places my name and addy are still showing as >acting NC, but I am going to start forwarding all of the stuff that I am >getting to all of you - kind of a share and share alike thing :-) ------=_NextPart_000_01E6_01BF7D30.25E79760 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Immediate Board Action Needed (2).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Immediate Board Action Needed (2).eml" Return-Path: Received: from imo11.mx.aol.com (imo11.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.1]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA00916 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 18:52:37 -0600 (CST) From: FEATHER2s@aol.com Received: from FEATHER2s@aol.com by imo11.mx.aol.com (IMOv18.1) id FIESa04329; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 19:45:26 +1900 (EST) Message-ID: <43992723.36ca1126@aol.com> Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 19:45:26 EST To: holt@txcyber.com, MSPIGLET@prodigy.net, hen1@idt.net, bwills@ionia-mi.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, bascs@snark.wizard.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net, tstowell@mccallie.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Immediate Board Action Needed Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 205 X-UIDL: 8fffd7bfce01c123d92464150856ea77 I agree with this totally. Let's get this done ASAP and tonight if at all humanly possible!! Ginger ------=_NextPart_000_01E6_01BF7D30.25E79760 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Immediate Board Action Needed (3).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Immediate Board Action Needed (3).eml" Return-Path: Received: from dexter.ionia-mi.net (root@dexter.ionia-mi.net [207.142.187.7]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA01431 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 18:54:42 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (max0-l18.ionia-mi.net [207.142.187.53]) by dexter.ionia-mi.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id TAA19922; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 19:53:57 -0500 (EST) From: "Beth Wills" To: "Ms. Piglet" , "Yvonne James-Henderson" , "Lynn Watermann" , "Kim Harris Myers" , "Kay Mason" , "Jim Powell" , "Jan Craven" , "Ginger Cisewski" , "Celia Snyder" , "Bridgett" , "Bill Oliver" , "Betsy" , "Bonnie McVicar Briggs" , , "Trey Holt" Subject: Re: Immediate Board Action Needed Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 19:56:56 -0500 Message-ID: <01be5a10$6a985fa0$35bb8ecf@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 X-UIDL: c3928936b09fb53298cf88599e468230 A motion has been made and seconded. I call the motion - and call for a vote. Beth Wills bwills@ionia-mi.net NE/NCentral Region Advisory Board C C Rep USGenWeb Project Ionia County MIGenWeb Coordinator http://www.rootsweb.com/~miionia Gladwin County MIGenWeb Coordinator http://www.rootsweb.com/~migladwi Saginaw County MIGenWeb Coordinator http://www.rootsweb.com/~misagina/Saginaw.html -----Original Message----- From: Trey Holt To: Ms. Piglet ; Yvonne James-Henderson ; Beth Wills ; Lynn Watermann ; Kim Harris Myers ; Kay Mason ; Jim Powell ; Jan Craven ; Ginger Cisewski ; Celia Snyder ; Bridgett ; Bill Oliver ; Betsy ; Bonnie McVicar Briggs ; tstowell@mccallie.org Date: Tuesday, February 16, 1999 7:40 PM Subject: Immediate Board Action Needed >Fellow Board members (I am including Kay and Jan in this discussion), > >I am PREPARED to make the following motion to the Board-L list if everyone >is in agreement. > >proposed motion: > >I move that the following statement be issued to as many mailing lists as >possible. and that the first paragraph be immediatly posted to the USGenWeb >Project web page concerning the special projects. > >"We "The USGenWeb Project Advisory Board" want to remind all persons >involved with "The USGenWeb Project" that all original records that are >transcribed and submitted to any special project whether it be "The >USGenWeb Archives Project", "The USGenWeb Census Project", "The USGenWeb >Tombstone Project" or any other special project are a part of The USGenWeb >Project's "digital library" known as "The USGenWeb Project Archives". >Patrons who submit data to "The USGenWeb Project Archives" through any of >its special projects should feel confident and be aware that no matter what >directory the data that they have submitted may reside, it is a part of >"The USGenWeb Project Archives". Patrons should also be aware that the >directory locations of any data submitted may change from time to time >within "The USGenWeb Project Archives" for organizational purposes. > >The Board strongly recommends that the special project named in the bylaws >as "The USGenWeb Archives Project" leave the job of transcribing original >US Census records and recruiting volunteers for the same purpose to the >special project named in the bylaws as "The USGenWeb Census Project" and >that "The USGenWeb Archives Project" should otherwise direct their efforts >to transcribing the other vast volumes of original records that need to be >transcribed in this country. "The USGenWeb Census Project" should continue >to notify the file managers of "The USGenWeb Archives Project" when new >transcriptions are completed so that these files may be included with >original scanned images or other county file structures as may have been >established or deemed neccessary. It is further the recommendation of this >board that at such time "The USGenWeb Census Project" completes its mission >and all US Census original records are transcribed and uploaded to the >"digital library" known as "The USGenWeb Project Archives" that an >assessment should be done of "The USGenWeb Project Archives" and any >duplicated files be combined." >--------- > > >In my opinion we need to expedite this tonight or ASAP and get this out. >One the motion is made and seconded a board member may call the vote in >which case the call and then the motion may be voted on. Things are being >set up on the archives list and it looks like Linda and Joy may be planning >to resign. No reasons were given but they are about to start conatcting >everyone who has submitted census records to ask permission to post in the >archives directory. The longer this goes on the more people are getting >confused and now everyone that has submitted data is about to get confused to. > >Lets please push this through ASAP. >This is the last comments I will make on this subject until you guys are >ready to proceed. I am very close however to start issuing my own >statements here and there because I'm not ready to see this whole thing go >down the tubes. > >Respectfully >Trey > ------=_NextPart_000_01E6_01BF7D30.25E79760-- [xxxxxxx] Tue Feb 22 13:28:29 2000 [xxxxxxx] Received: from mail1.radix.net (mail1.radix.net [207.192.128.31]) by saltmine.radix.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA15584 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:28:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from [xxxxxx] ([xxxxxx] [199.184.119.1]) by mail1.radix.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA22690 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 13:28:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (nei-pm2-018.inetnebr.com [206.222.223.92]) by [xxxxxx] (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA19781; Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:28:20 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <01f401bf7d62$8405c1a0$5cdfdece@default> [xxxxxxx] To: "merope" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:27:44 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_01F1_01BF7D30.395A88C0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01F1_01BF7D30.395A88C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------=_NextPart_000_01F1_01BF7D30.395A88C0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Immediate Board Action Needed (4).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Immediate Board Action Needed (4).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.1starnet.com (1starnet.com [207.243.104.17]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id TAA06094 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 19:12:58 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199902170112.TAA06094@[xxxxxx]> Received: from betsy [207.243.104.157] by mail.1starnet.com (SMTPD32-4.06) id A78C2740134; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 19:12:44 CST X-Sender: betsym@1starnet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0.1 Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 19:09:04 -0600 To: "Beth Wills" , "Ms. Piglet" , "Yvonne James-Henderson" , "Lynn Watermann" , "Kim Harris Myers" , "Kay Mason" , "Jim Powell" , "Jan Craven" , "Ginger Cisewski" , "Celia Snyder" , "Bridgett" , "Bill Oliver" , "Bonnie McVicar Briggs" , , "Trey Holt" From: Betsy Mills Subject: Re: Immediate Board Action Needed In-Reply-To: <01be5a10$6a985fa0$35bb8ecf@default> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-UIDL: 2f5d61f917edcafbd87217e7e601dcf7 No way!! There must be discussion first and this must be made on the board list if you are going to make it a motion. Does EVERYTHING have to be a formal vote and motion????? I have a question: >>It is further the recommendation of this >>board that at such time "The USGenWeb Census Project" completes its mission >>and all US Census original records are transcribed and uploaded to the >>"digital library" known as "The USGenWeb Project Archives" that an >>assessment should be done of "The USGenWeb Project Archives" and any >>duplicated files be combined." >>--------- What is meant by "duplicated files" and how can you combine duplicated files?? Thanks! Betsy ------=_NextPart_000_01F1_01BF7D30.395A88C0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Immediate Board Action Needed (5).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Immediate Board Action Needed (5).eml" Return-Path: Received: from jubjub.wizard.com (jubjub.wizard.com [199.171.28.9]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA06960 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 19:16:31 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (pm3-5-028.wizard.com [208.211.53.28]) by jubjub.wizard.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id RAA27133; Tue, 16 Feb 1999 17:23:29 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199902170123.RAA27133@jubjub.wizard.com> From: "Bridgett Smith" To: bwills@ionia-mi.net, cgsnyder@uiuc.edu, hen1@idt.net, holt@txcyber.com, mspiglet@prodigy.net, cestus3@inetnebr.com, estral@switchboard.net, kmfkm@ptw.com, jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net, jcraven@usunwired.net, FEATHER2s@aol.com, wnoliver@worldnet.att.net, betsym@1starnet.com, tstowell@mccallie.org, mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 17:15:38 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Immediate Board Action Needed Priority: normal In-reply-to: <3.0.3.32.19990216183943.0087dec0@txcyber.com> References: <055201be5943$89ef6100$180a9cd1@william> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) X-UIDL: 9d32994b32e28762864789660e7d024b I think Trey's proposal holds merit. Trey, do you know why both Linda and Joy are thinking of resigning? Bridgett On 16 Feb 99, at 18:39, Trey Holt wrote: > I am PREPARED to make the following motion to the Board-L list if everyone > is in agreement. > > proposed motion: > > I move that the following statement be issued to as many mailing lists as > possible. and that the first paragraph be immediatly posted to the > USGenWeb Project web page concerning the special projects. Bridgett Smith SC Rep SE/Mid-Atlantic Region bascs@wizard.com *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* TNGenWeb State Coordinator http://www.tngenweb.org/ ------=_NextPart_000_01F1_01BF7D30.395A88C0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Immediate Board Action Needed (6).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Immediate Board Action Needed (6).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc06.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc06.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.41]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA28060 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 20:41:37 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.70.2.91]) by mtiwmhc06.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990217024106.CUJP28055@worldnet.att.net>; Wed, 17 Feb 1999 02:41:06 +0000 Message-ID: <36CA2C82.DB3DB109@worldnet.att.net> Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 21:42:10 -0500 From: jpowelljr X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Trey Holt CC: "Ms. Piglet" , Yvonne James-Henderson , Beth Wills , Lynn Watermann , Kim Harris Myers , Kay Mason , Jan Craven , Ginger Cisewski , Celia Snyder , Bridgett , Bill Oliver , Betsy , Bonnie McVicar Briggs , tstowell@mccallie.org Subject: Re: Immediate Board Action Needed References: <3.0.3.32.19990216183943.0087dec0@txcyber.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 088c0f62fb8c68aa7c2b9de7aa12e6ee I think Trey should go ahead and make the motion on Board-l and then we should work with it. Jim ------=_NextPart_000_01F1_01BF7D30.395A88C0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Immediate Board Action Needed.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Immediate Board Action Needed.eml" Return-Path: Received: from mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.39]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA29559 [xxxxxx] Tue, 16 Feb 1999 18:47:03 -0600 (CST) Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.76.100.53]) by mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07 118 124) with ESMTP id <19990217004625.KNKL22890@worldnet.att.net>; Wed, 17 Feb 1999 00:46:25 +0000 Message-ID: <36CA1120.8079605F@worldnet.att.net> Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 19:45:21 -0500 From: William N Oliver Reply-To: wnoliver@worldnet.att.net Organization: NEGenWeb/OHGenWeb/USGenWeb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,nl,de-CH,de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Trey Holt CC: "Ms. Piglet" , Yvonne James-Henderson , Beth Wills , Lynn Watermann , Kim Harris Myers , Kay Mason , Jim Powell , Jan Craven , Ginger Cisewski , Celia Snyder , Bridgett , Betsy , Bonnie McVicar Briggs , tstowell@mccallie.org Subject: Re: Immediate Board Action Needed References: <3.0.3.32.19990216183943.0087dec0@txcyber.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 6fcf3297c467b75c56b590e607871ec3 Aye!! and, second the move. Would appreciate the following correction in punctuation in the first sentence: We, "The .... Board", want .... Bill -- =======================> Trey Holt wrote: > Fellow Board members (I am including Kay and Jan in this discussion), > > I am PREPARED to make the following motion to the Board-L list if everyone > is in agreement. > > proposed motion: > > I move that the following statement be issued to as many mailing lists as > possible. and that the first paragraph be immediatly posted to the USGenWeb > Project web page concerning the special projects. > > "We "The USGenWeb Project Advisory Board" want to remind all persons > involved with "The USGenWeb Project" that all original records that are > transcribed and submitted to any special project whether it be "The > USGenWeb Archives Project", "The USGenWeb Census Project", "The USGenWeb > Tombstone Project" or any other special project are a part of The USGenWeb > Project's "digital library" known as "The USGenWeb Project Archives". > Patrons who submit data to "The USGenWeb Project Archives" through any of > its special projects should feel confident and be aware that no matter what > directory the data that they have submitted may reside, it is a part of > "The USGenWeb Project Archives". Patrons should also be aware that the > directory locations of any data submitted may change from time to time > within "The USGenWeb Project Archives" for organizational purposes. > > The Board strongly recommends that the special project named in the bylaws > as "The USGenWeb Archives Project" leave the job of transcribing original > US Census records and recruiting volunteers for the same purpose to the > special project named in the bylaws as "The USGenWeb Census Project" and > that "The USGenWeb Archives Project" should otherwise direct their efforts > to transcribing the other vast volumes of original records that need to be > transcribed in this country. "The USGenWeb Census Project" should continue > to notify the file managers of "The USGenWeb Archives Project" when new > transcriptions are completed so that these files may be included with > original scanned images or other county file structures as may have been > established or deemed neccessary. It is further the recommendation of this > board that at such time "The USGenWeb Census Project" completes its mission > and all US Census original records are transcribed and uploaded to the > "digital library" known as "The USGenWeb Project Archives" that an > assessment should be done of "The USGenWeb Project Archives" and any > duplicated files be combined." > --------- > > In my opinion we need to expedite this tonight or ASAP and get this out. > One the motion is made and seconded a board member may call the vote in > which case the call and then the motion may be voted on. Things are being > set up on the archives list and it looks like Linda and Joy may be planning > to resign. No reasons were given but they are about to start conatcting > everyone who has submitted census records to ask permission to post in the > archives directory. The longer this goes on the more people are getting > confused and now everyone that has submitted data is about to get confused to. > > Lets please push this through ASAP. > This is the last comments I will make on this subject until you guys are > ready to proceed. I am very close however to start issuing my own > statements here and there because I'm not ready to see this whole thing go > down the tubes. > > Respectfully > Trey ------=_NextPart_000_01F1_01BF7D30.395A88C0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Jan's statement (2).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Jan's statement (2).eml" Return-Path: Received: from mail.networkone.net (root@mail.networkone.net [209.144.112.75]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA18330 [xxxxxx] Sat, 27 Feb 1999 12:11:27 -0600 (CST) Received: from default (assured-01-114.ln.networkone.net [209.144.118.115]) by mail.networkone.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id KAA04442; Sat, 27 Feb 1999 10:10:53 -0800 Message-Id: <199902271810.KAA04442@mail.networkone.net> From: "Kay Mason" To: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Kay Mason , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Bill Oliver , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , Linda Russell Lewis , Betsy Mills Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 10:07:56 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Jan's statement Reply-to: kmfkm@ptw.com Priority: normal In-reply-to: <199902271757.JAA03247@mail.networkone.net> References: <019401be626e$c46f36a0$a90b9cd1@william> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT X-UIDL: 717224c9ebf40fc51abca4bc285a2ef0 Betsy, I'm saying this to everyone. I was not aware that I was refusing to speak to you. I don't think that you are on Linda's side or my side. I have always felt that you want what is best for USGW, and so do I, and I sending along some comments on some of the subjects that we have been discussing in other posts. Kay Date sent: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 11:53:07 -0600 To: Jan Craven , Bridgett Smith , Kay Mason , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Bill Oliver , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , Linda Russell Lewis From: Betsy Mills Subject: Re: Jan's statement > I have to tell you, I am like Jan in this matter. We are wasting our time > discussing this. Linda answers the questions and gets further questions that > she seems to think begin to sound like attacks. Kay refuses to answer > anything. Exactly what are we accomplishing?? Nothing. Megan has made some > great remarks that get to the heart of the matter. If we had disagreed with > Kay, she would most likely have refused to comply, too. We have two parties > here who both refuse to budge an inch. So, what is the solution?? > > I am on neither side, but Kay now refuses to speak to me seeming to believe I > am taking Linda's side. Yes, I still talk to Linda, but I think she will be > the first to tell you that I am not "on her side." Yes, there was a private > meeting of some of the board members on IRC the other night. I could list > names, but that won't solve anything (I was not one of them). This is now > dividing the board and I for one do not want to see this happen. We CAN work > together but this issue MUST see a commitment from BOTH Kay and Linda to work > it out, otherwise we are wasting our time. > > Betsy > > > At 10:32 AM 02/27/1999 -0600, you wrote: > >Jan....I have to take issue with that statement (and respectfully note that > >you're not a disinterested party, here, being pretty much assumed to be on > >Linda's side of the conflict as Archives rep), because it seems to state > >that individuals can make disruptive and by that, destructive moves in the > >project, and if they don't care to stop it's none of the board's business. > > > >Having said that, I don't know what we should or can do. Perhaps if we have > >no official powers in the matter we should even make a public statement to > >that effect---that the board believes that both parties are acting in a > >manner contrary to the interests of the project in their actions of > >(enumerating actions) which the board deeply disapproves but has no power to > >correct. > > > >That might have the consequences of pulling the rug out from under both the > >board and the bylaws, proving they're both pointless, or it might lead to > >fixing the situation. It at least has the virtue of public honesty. > > > >piglet (megan zurawicz) ICQ: 18429839 > >note: was pigolit@ix.netcom.com, now mspiglet@prodigy.net > >genealogy-- http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~piglet > >quilting-- http://pages.prodigy.net/mspiglet > >theatre-- http://members.aol.com/tupacratz/poohpix.htm > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: Jan Craven > >To: FEATHER2s@aol.com cityslic@ix.netcom.com > > bascs@snark.wizard.com > >Cc: bwills@ionia-mi.net cgsnyder@uiuc.edu > > hen1@idt.net holt@txcyber.com > > mspiglet@prodigy.net > >cestus3@inetnebr.com estral@switchboard.net > > kmfkm@ptw.com > >jpowelljr@worldnet.att.net > >wnoliver@worldnet.att.net betsym@1starnet.com > > tstowell@mccallie.org > >mishiawa@shiatel.tds.net > >Date: Friday, 26 February, 1999 18:16 > >Subject: Re: Linda's message to SE/MA mailing list (census) > > > > > >>Folks, > >>We are beating a dead horse. The problem is between Linda and Kay > >>and until THEY decide to solve it there no need to discuss it. > >>Jan > > > USGenWeb Census Project http://www.usgenweb.org/census/ http://www.usgenweb.com/census http://www.usgenweb.net/census/ Montgomery County Mississippi http://www.rootsweb.com/~msmontgo/ Rock County Nebraska http://www.rootsweb.com/~nerock/ ------=_NextPart_000_01F1_01BF7D30.395A88C0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re Jan's statement (3).eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re Jan's statement (3).eml" Return-Path: Received: from usunwired.net (mailserver.usunwired.net [208.215.35.11]) by [xxxxxx] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id OAA18097 [xxxxxx] Sat, 27 Feb 1999 14:52:50 -0600 (CST) Received: from jcraven.iamerica.net [208.241.128.248] by usunwired.net (SMTPD32-4.07) id AAE51D2700DE; Sat, 27 Feb 1999 14:51:49 CDT Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19990227145351.0089cc60@mail.usunwired.net> X-Sender: jcraven@mail.usunwired.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 14:53:51 -0700 To: Betsy Mills , Bridgett Smith , Kay Mason , Pam Reid , Yvonne James-Henderson , Celia Snyder , Beth Wills , Ginger Cisewski , Kim Harris-Myers , Trey Holt , Bill Oliver , Betsy Mills , Tim Stowell , Jim Powell , Megan Zurawicz , Lynn Watermann , Bonnie McVicar-Briggs , Linda Russell Lewis From: Jan Craven Subject: Re: Jan's statement